Band of Bothers

PMI Sister Wives

Utah based Professional Marketing International is a proud member of the Alliance for Lifelong Learning. According to The Alliance

“Consumers can be assured that Members of the Alliance for Lifelong Learning maintain the highest level of integrity; employ experienced qualified instructors, coaches, and mentors; and follow strict standards and practices.”

Utah’s stellar Attorney General Mark Shurtleff helped to set-up The Alliance :: apparently to make sure everything continued to run smoothly in Utah’s lucrative fraud exporting sector.

When PMI’s head-honcho Phil Smith isn’t boiling leads for hack-bastard-morons like Anthony Morrison and Dean Graziosi … he’s serving as the chairman of the Alliance for Lifelong Learning … ensuring standards and integrity and shit.

In 2009 The Alliance met on K Street to consider all of their old-lady screwing options. Guess who came up in the discussions?

“Members expressed their challenges on consumer complaints.  It was suggested that Mr. Nixon visit the Utah Attorney General’s Office on April 2, 2009 to discuss the concerns and possible solutions to improve customer relations. Following his visit, the Standards and Practices Committee agreed to have a telephone conference on April 6, 2009.  The Standards and Practices committee will draft a revision of the current Standards and Practices to include disciplinary measures for violations of the Standards and Practices.”

Why enforce the law when you can set up meetings instead?

“In response to recent media inquiries regarding political campaign contributions, particularly those to Mr. Mark Shurtleff, Mr. Nixon encouraged members to respond positively and inform the media they have made additional contributions to other candidates and parties as well. Subsequently, Mr. Nixon offered media training upon request.”

Campaign records show that Professional Marketing International contributed big monies to Mark Shurtleff.

For The Alliance!!

Me wonders if Mr. Nixon offers any media trainings regarding fake robots who publish The Alliance’s manipulation and destruction sales scripts?

Prolly not … some medias are harder to train for than others.

Mr. Smith might just need to go totally old-school and put his lying fucking head between his knees :: cause it’s about to get way worser :: here’s a teasing taste …

… no fear …

… someone should call Standards & Practices … that sounded bad.

The Alliance might want to speak with some folks who have real world experience dealing with fake robots.  May I please introduce the The Alliance to The Syndicate and The Secret?

Oh that’s right :: y’all are already acquainted …

>> bleep bloop

82 thoughts on “Band of Bothers”

  1. Salty, sorry, didn’t know how else to tell you, but you spelled Graziosi wrong and need to correct it (forgot the ‘r’).

  2. Please, could someone make a transcript? English is not my native language so I can’t understand his words clearly.

    1. @Serge Tchakhotine,

      I am under the impression that Salty purposefully made the sound snippet all garbly and echo-ey with sinister-sounding reverb to build anticipation for an upcoming post. If you listen real close you can only pick up occasional phrases, no matter how good of a command of English you have.

      In other words, knowing the Droid, I’m guessing we should just stay tuned. I suspect more is on the way.

      1. @mojo ::

        It would be rather rude and thoughtless of me to only publish one minute of the fifty horrible minutes on that tape …

        And I wouldn’t want to be rude to all of the law abiding citizens of The Alliance.

        1. @SD,

          Rude? Thoughtless? YOU?

          Who would ever SAY such a thing?

          I am shocked, SHOCKED, I tell you! And here’s the emoticon to prove it!


      2. @mojo, That’s probably the case, but with my sound card (as well as all the ambient noise in this office, and the fact that I was trying to keep the volume down so it wouldn’t disturb my office mate) I couldn’t tell. But you can be sure I will listen to the real thing when Salty makes it available.

  3. I confess that I couldn’t really make out the words in the audio — maybe it’s my sound card — but the meeting minutes told plenty. In addition to the mentions of our favorite corrupt Utah A.G., there was this snippet, f’rinstance:

    “Ms. Andreen [legislative assistant to Sen. Orrin Hatch] commented on how important it is to form associations with members that work together on specific issues and deliver accurate language in a united voice, which will more likely influence current and upcoming legislation.

    “Ms. Andreen indicated that there was no specific bill regarding this industry introduced at this time, although she did mention that the Alliance could look at the Workforce Investment Act, a current reauthorization bill, to see if sections could be amended to benefit the members.”

    And a little later…

    “Benjamin May, the corporate counsel for Policy Impact, discussed the current status of appeals to the FCC to clarify the state preemption clause to the Telephone Consumer Protection Act (TCPA). Currently, states are allowed to regulate interstate commerce, something that adds cost in time and finances to cope with. Mr. May mentioned that as far as he can tell, other than requesting comments from the general public the FCC, has remained silent on the subject and seems to have left the interpretation of this clause in the TCPA up to the federal courts. The board then discussed the possible actions to be made to swing the interpretation in a way that will benefit the Alliance’s members and their customers. Mr. May said that PIC would continue to look into the FCC’s involvement in the interpretation of the TCPA clause and how to best influence policy on this matter.”

    I hate to point out the obvious (okay, I don’t) but it seems to me that it isn’t possible to benefit the Alliance’s members AND their customers. Kind of an either/or deal, one would think.

    “Congressman McKeon and the members discussed how proprietary educational institutions have been given a bad reputation because they are not accredited and many have been accused of providing false claims.”

    You don’t say!

    The above was immediately followed by:
    “Subsequently, Congressman McKeon and members discussed financial aid for higher education. Alliance members have not been successful in acquiring funding for students mainly due to accreditation issues. It was suggested that the Alliance focus on acquiring funding through higher education and work force training segments.”

    Does that mean finding new ways to screw the government as well as the client/victims? I’m kind of confused.

    Now, I know that many industries do whatever they can to ‘influence’ legislation. It just seems particularly egregious when the influencing is done by an industry that is in the business of screwing some of our most vulnerable citizens.

    Something tells me the Utah boiler rooms are about to boil over.

    1. @Cosmic Connie, from the Alliance’s perspective, their “customers” are fine folks like Dean Graziosi, Mike Filsaime, John Commuta, Brad Fallon, Anthony Morrison, Joe Vitale, Stephen Pierce, etc.

      1. @Unicorn Army, Oh, yeah, I forgot that part of it. Obviously I was thinking of the actual consumers of the “education” frauducts and services, the people who of course are victimized not only by the Alliance but by their “strategic partners,” the fine folks you named. I thought the Alliance members were actually feigning concern over the well being of the victims.

          1. @Jack, Hi Jack. I wonder if Frank’s bus comes with a motor, cause I know in Hollywood, props usually don’t have anything inside them. I sometimes wonder that about Frank’s head also.

          2. @Jack, I hope I win Frank’s Joe Mangel camper van…

            I’ll get the f*cker crushed and Fedex it to him as 5 inch tin can!

            The Joe Mangel Reference there for Poms and Aussies. Ahhh… can’t go back!

  4. I made 2 highlights of audio for those having trouble with hearing it:

    “I know that it works” (even though probably we don’t have any statistical documentation about this one)
    “If you put the time into it and do the things we ask you to do, you will find success and you will be wealthy.”

    1. @Jack ::

      … and …

      “You’re single, secretary, 56 years old making $24,000 per year and looking to make a change.”

      … good times.

  5. I found out about that maybe I could make an audio for people to hear it better when I went on YouTube and watched some f.r.e.e. videos for how to try to clean it up, so I put it here:

    At first maybe I thought I should pay mr. Jenkins $2,000 to find out how to do it, but then I remembered about the YouTube site.

    It’s the embed code here, but probably doesn’t work on this site:
    No-Fear by JackBewildered

    1. @Jack, I’m pretty sure that the robot intended for the recording to sound just as it did. You aren’t meant to necessarily take much from it, other than to expect more to come.

  6. One of my favorite things about going to the movies are the trailers… One of my favorite things about this blog… Are the teasers… Ooohhh… I caint wait!

  7. More fucking Mormons stealing your money so they can think they are being Christians by paying 10% of it back to their great Mormon God in the sky and keeping the rest.

    Fuck. Fuck. Fuck. Fuck.

    Someone stop the bullshit already!

    1. @Bruce DIckinson, Whenever I hear the word Mormon it always involves acquiring money by illicit means.

      I got slapped by Mormons with my first ever website. A company called Commercial Networks in the UK were cold calling businesses – basically jumping on the wave of excitement about this new-ish thing called the internet.

      Domain name plus 5 page website (no copy included) £700

      They were shown on the news at the time for the money they were raking in. When they made a sale, an alarm sounded in the office (plus electronic scoreboard keeping sales) and everyone started jumping up and down like monkeys, celebrating every theft. Sick bastards.

      By about 2002 they’d legged it to Utah, again on the news!

      It ended not so good, I lost the site and domain because they wouldn’t allow you to edit it yourself nor move the site away from them.

      Ahhh Good Times… Not!

  8. Shurtleff has always been in the business of making Utah a haven for pyramid schemers, MLM’s , and grifters of all persuasions.

    He personally endorsed USANA HEALTH SCIENCES and they paid him for that endorsment very well indeed.

    (If I mention Jonathan Turley’s name again will the big foot come down?)

    1. @Barbara,
      Not being a US citizen, I had to google Turley. An awkward sod, one of the good guys, yeah?

      1. @Stoic, yeah..I just had mentioned Turley and Shurtleff about to square off on the whole Sister Wives hot mess, boiling it down to its essence: Turley has filed a lawsuit challenging Utah’s bigamy law.Anyway, when I mentioned Turley I was “warned”…just a joke…

        I miss Turley’s appearances on Keith Olbermann, just one more reason to miss K.O., like most of the United States I cannot get the Current channel on cable.

    2. @Barbara, And there can be not the doubt mr. Shurtleff has reached Saint-Hoodlum status, but without teh Saint part.

      1. As it happens, Mark Shurtleff’s name has come up in a book I’m now reading and am about halfway through, “Secrets & Wives: The Hidden World of Mormon Polygamy” by Sanjiv Bhattacharya.
        It was of course written before the Turley lawsuit came about, but offers some interesting insights.

        When not busy with his own book-writin’ and cozying up to the boiler rooms, Shurtleff has been engaged for years in the delicate dance between mainstream Mormon moral outrage over polygamy, and keeping the plgys placated. (I apologize for all of the alliteration.) This has been discussed here before but I think it’s worthy of revisiting.

        Although Warren Jeffs and his FLDS group are currently making the headlines because of Jeffs’ trial, arguably the most shocking stuff goes on in another smaller polygamy group known as the Kingstons, or the Order. There’s a long chapter on the Order about halfway through “Secrets & Wives,” and I think that chapter alone makes the book worth reading. Polygamy is the very least of this group’s misdeeds (provided one considers polygamy itself a misdeed…but it is, after all, illegal, even in Utah. And even if one doesn’t hold to the belief that polygamy should be a crime, the other practices in the Order and similar groups are appalling.).

        The Kingston group has been in the news numerous times over the years, so anyone who is familiar with their history can skip over the next few paragraphs till you get down to the mention of Shurtleff.

        One huge problem in the Order is the practice of forced marriages of underage girls, and not surprisingly, the current group leader/prophet/holy man, Paul Kingston and his bros get the pick of the young girls. Some are twelve or younger when they get picked.

        Though the Kingston business empire is filthy rich, most of the followers are forced to live lives of extreme austerity, even poverty. Kids are recruited for what amounts to slave labor in various Kingston enterprises. Order members don’t have control of their own money or property, and are expected to “consecrate” all of their material goods – that is, give it all to the Order. Despite the Order’s wealth, families are encouraged to grab as much government assistance as they can get, and there’s a ton of welfare fraud. Apparently it is their way of thumbing their nose at the government that has both “persecuted” them (and on occasion prosecuted them) for years.

        And there’s the child abuse. The elders believe in very strict discipline. Even babies are sometimes beaten till they’re black and blue. It’s kept very hush-hush for the most part, but of course these things have a way of leaking out.

        Then there’s the incest. The Kingstons believe they are direct descendants of Jesus H. Christ Himself, and therefore they need to keep the bloodline as “pure” as possible. As you can imagine, generations of inbreeding have taken their toll, but horrible deformities (reportedly one baby was born without eyes, arms, or legs), stillbirths, and the like are apparently considered small sacrifices to the greater good of producing hundreds and thousands of “pure-breeds.” Seems the Order intends to take over the planet and usher in a new paradise, and there’s strength in numbers.

        Writes Bhattacharya, “Today there’s so much incest going on in the Order that the family trees contort like grape vines wrapping around each other.” Yet, he notes, there has been little prosecution over the years, and since Shurtleff took office in 2000, there have been only two incest convictions, both of which were as an adjunct charge to the crime of statutory rape. One of the convicted served just under a year.

        After a brief discussion about whether or not incest should be a crime, Bhattacharya concludes that even absent genetic anomalies (and one genetics expert he consulted said the risks have probably been overstated), the normalization of consanguinity is very destructive to children. He continues:

        “…the Order is an example of a society in which these sexual taboos have not only been normalized but protected by a culture of secrecy, one that employs decoy surnames to conceal biological relationships. For these reasons and others, attorney general Shurtleff, himself a high-ranking Mormon, has threatened to take a stand on more than one occasion. Sadly, nothing has come of it, so far. The last time he attempted to procure the DNA evidence he needed to prosecute, he decided to ask the Kingstons for their cooperation first – so obviously, they left town. That was in 2006, and it was no small embarrassment for the AG’s office.

        “ ‘It became known that we had obtained several dozen warrants,’ Shurtleff told me one day in his office. ‘We ordered them to be closed, secret, but someone – an attorney from that group or whoever – told the press and so it came out that we had these warrants set to go. The trouble was, we knew it would be difficult to serve those warrants and actually obtain DNA – how do you do that in a peaceful manner, how do you avoid looking like storm troopers coming into their churches and homes and grabbing children and swabbing their mouths? So we thought we’d take the peaceful approach and go ask their prophet to cooperate. Of course that backfired.’

        “Shurtleff’s tenure as attorney general has been at least partly defined by his approach to polygamy. It’s a delicate game. On the one hand, he’s taking down Warren Jeffs, and on the other, he’s reaching out to polygamists through his Safety Net program, an effort to build bridges between polygamist groups and state agencies….

        “…[Shurtleff says], ‘It’s very difficult. How do you do mass warrants and evidence gathering with a group that indicates it is not going to cooperate?’”

        Bhattacharya goes on to write that the Texas AG, Greg Abbott, wasn’t so concerned about the fine points when he went after Warren Jeffs’ FLDS compound in Texas. The author adds that Abbott no doubt paid a political price for the way it all went down. But Abbott’s defenders feel that crimes such as [forced] underage marriage are sufficiently serious to warrant such risks.

        Concludes Bhattacharya, “In Utah, with regard to the crime of incest within a cult, Mark Shurtleff appears to have made a different calculation. Over the last few years, he has preserved his good relationship with the fundamentalist community by continuing to wait for the perpetrators to ‘come forward.’ In the meantime, however, he has taken the decisive step of removing alcopops and wine coolers from Utah’s supermarkets.”

        Damn, I love those snarky journos.

        Now, I understand the constitutional issues, religious-freedom matters, privacy rights, and so forth that Shurtleff faces. But still. Child labor. Babies being beaten till they’re black and blue. Incest as the path to a superior race. Not to mention the welfare fraud – and racists can’t blame the usual suspects, people of color, for this, since the Order is all very, very white. (In fact they loathe blacks. Are Blacks Not Men? Well, maybe, but terribly inferior ones, according to the Order.).

        And still the Order goes on and on and on.

        Given Shurtleff’s lame efforts to end the horrendous abuse in one little seekrit community, his endorsement of ChildHelp (mentioned on this post on Salty’s blog ) seems particularly ludicrous. In a statement last September regarding his keynote speech at one of their upcoming events, he said, “One of my top priorities as attorney general is to fight the scourge of child abuse. We can only save our children by working together as an entire community…” blah-blah-blah. (And for those of you who haven’t been here very long, here’s a link to another Salty blog about Shurtleff’s hypocrisy re his pledge to protect kids .)

        Alas, Shurtleff’s efforts to reach out to the general plyg community didn’t stop Turley from that lawsuit on behalf of the Brown family. (Interesting discussion about that here. )

        But I imagine that with all of the boiler-room stuff that’s coming to light, the Turley suit is the least of Shurtleff’s problems.

        1. @Cosmic Connie ::


          There isn’t a religious issue at all IMO.

          You can’t rape kids … especially ones that you’re related to … that’s pretty much that.

          Polygamy is religious though … and it’s criminalized. So it’s driven underground into a black market for religious freedom … and all black markets come to be dominated by the worstest of the worst.

          Drugs don’t destroy nearly as many lives as the black market for drugs.

          Black markets also have a nasty tendency to corrupt spineless :: moral cowardice exhibiting :: politicians.

          The boiler room story overlaps with the polygamy story and the child bootcamp story … and that’s all I’ll say about that … for now.

          1. @SD, I absolutely agree that sexual abuse of children is not a religious issue. However, since under-aged sex and incest are so deeply entwined in the Order society (and other polygamous cults, I imagine), they sometimes get lost in the freedom-of-religion issues. This is particularly so when you have Mormons such as Shurtleff in positions of power, for even though mainstream Mormonism rejected polygamy a long time ago, the Latter-Day Saints still have that whole persecution-complex thing going for them, and I think that as a result they are more likely to be sympathetic to the non-mainstream Mormons.

            In any case I agree that the criminalization of polygamy drives it underground and allows the abuses to continue. And it gives abusive polygamists a martyr platform, which further clouds the real issues. In any case Shurtleff’s attempts to play both sides on the plyg issue is gonna backfire on him big time, I suspect. I await with baited breath the next revelations from our favorite little robot.

            1. I want to add that incest and the whole underaged-marriage thing are doctrinal within the Kingston group. Order members justify these practices not only on racial-purity grounds but also on grounds that Bible people did that stuff way back when. If it was good enough for Abraham, it’s good enough for them.

              1. @Cosmic Connie ::

                Fine :: they can believe that just as hard as they want … but they can’t act it out against underage citizens of the United States of America.

                Well :: they can … but it’s fucking bollux.

            2. I hope it’s clear that I’m not an apologist for polygamous groups that practice atrocities such as incest with minors (or forced underage marriages/sexual assault/child abuse, etc.), and I am not trying to downplay the horror. My intent was only to point out some of the factors that cause these vile acts to be clouded by other issues. And I mentioned that incest, etc. are embedded in the religious doctrine of the Kingston group, aka the Order, not because I am excusing them (anyone who knows my views on organized religion would know better), but because those are the arguments and rationalizations the Order uses.

              The problems are compounded because the Order and similar groups are very secretive and very good at disguising what goes on in the groups. Where there is secrecy there is not only the potential for real horror, as Salty pointed out in a comment above, but there is also the potential for outsiders to fill in the blanks and draw their own conclusions, which may or may not be accurate.

              Hence the Texas raid of Warren Jeffs’ FLDS compound was originally based on what turned out to be a hoax phone call, and hundreds of children were removed from the compound and apparently traumatized by that removal. Yet in the end Jeffs went to trial in Texas, and yesterday he was pronounced guilty and faces a life sentence. (Go, Texas AG! Quote after yesterday’s verdict: “Here in the state of Texas, juries render tough, swift justice against anyone who would sexually assault a child.” We can’t say the same for Utah yet, can we?)

              Some would say the end justified the means here because Jeffs *was* abusing under-aged females, but whenever you have a case like this you also have hundreds of anti-government activists who say the government is being oppressive, behaving like Storm Troopers, etc. And in some cases there is something to be said for this argument.

              So when I say that I understand the fine (legal) line that government agencies have to walk in these cases this doesn’t mean that I am in any way advocating sexual or other types of physical or emotional abuse of children or anyone else. And the abuse in the Order, at the hands of brothers of the “Prophet,” Paul Kingston and some of their wives and supporters, is appalling. The things I mentioned in my comment above were just the tip of the iceberg. If you read the book, “Secrets & Wives,” some of it will turn your stomach.

              The moral imperative to protect or rescue children from real abuse is clear. Unfortunately it is all too often muddied by other issues.

  9. @Stoic,

    The operator of the robot went to the George Washington University Law School, the oldest law school in the U.S. Turley is a professor there and, unlike the “academics”, he actually practices law. Mostly going after evildoers and rattling cages from time to time. Some here may be a bit protective of Professor Turley and his work. Now you’re in on all the fun!

    1. @SyndicateExposed, Now it seems he’s upping the anti from his previous offer of the “$50,000” home, because now he said:

      “YES! You Can Win A $60,000+ Home… No Catch…No Strings… No Kidding!”

      & also has said on the page:

      “Want The Keys To My House FREE?”

      which seems to mean that mr. MILLIONAIRE Graziosi lives in a $60,000 house? It’s good for him to be so frugal I suppose.

      1. @Jack, Hi Jack. Maybe he thinks the house is worth more because he just installed indoor plumbing. Or maybe he just isn’t good with math. I wonder, if he isn’t good with math, how he knows he is a millionaire? Maybe one of his co-workers at Wal-Mart told him. That co-worker should be promoted to head of marketing.

  10. Question Saltius Droidus

    Why have you not gone after Clickbank, which seems to be the source of some of the most fraudicious scams on the internet. There marketplace top 20 is a whose who of some of the top spammers and scammers in the industry.

    Carry On

    1. @Otto Von Bacon, seems like Clickbank have started closing accounts now…


      SUBJECT: “Account “fmtraffic” will no longer be selling products through ClickBank ”

      Dear ClickBank Client,

      This message is being sent as a courtesy to inform you that the account “fmtraffic” will no longer be selling products through ClickBank as of Friday July 29th. Please discontinue all advertising campaigns and promotions for this account(s) effective immediately. Should you have any questions or concerns related to this update, please contact the ClickBank Client Support Team at

      We appreciate your cooperation and understanding.

      ClickBank Operations Team

      P.S. Please discontinue all advertising campaigns and promotions for this account(s) effective immediately.

    2. @Otto Von Bacon, Ho hum. Please see the previous few hundred posts from Salty about who he goes after and why. A clue: the guys he’s talking about here do things like deliberately targeting the elderly, worming credit limit information out of people and charging them to the limit without their knowledge, using credit companies in other countries that won’t refund fraudulently charged cards, and get out of jail free by buying off politicians. Clickbank? Most of its products are no more than $50 bucks, money refunded if you complain, vendors dropped if they get too many complaints. Are most of the products junk? Sure. Is its continued existence going to undermine the legal system of the US and put a lot of seniors and disabled people out on the street, eating catfood and begging in front of Starbucks? Probably not. See the difference?

      1. @Wanderlost, Clickbank is part of the machine, but as you say, a small part. Sellers get a name and email on customers, but nothing else, which is why the “boiler room” crowd isn’t selling there.

        1. Good points about Clickbank being a small(ish) part of the machine. Of course this doesn’t prevent some of the bigger players — those who have strategic partnerships with some of the very boiler-room companies mentioned on this post and others — from exploiting the hell out of Clickbank, using low-priced frauducts to lure people into the ridiculously high-priced ones.

          Case in point: a recently introduced $39 treasure from two of our old friends, one of whom is a “strategic partner” with Utah’s Prosper boiler room (for his coaching program). He is now claiming that he was homeless for MANY years — as opposed to a brief period in his life in the late 1970s. The sales copy also claims that he lived a life of dead-end jobs, struggling and ignorant about marketing, for “almost 3 decades” AFTER he was “homeless” (and previously he’d claimed he was “homeless” in the late 1970s. You do the math.).

          Anyway, this new offering purports to tell you how you, too, can get obscenely wealthy while you sleep, using ClickBank “secrets.” Among other things you will learn “How To Create A Killer ClickBank Product Out Of Thin Air…”

          All this for only $39, the same price as the Hoshun Wish Dolly!

          1. @Cosmic Connie, ClickBank has been looking the other way for YEARS. If regular people on the street could see what was going on long ago, ClickBank’s management surely could!

            They are simply reacting conspicuously at this late date in order to protect their own cash cow from governmental intervention.

            On their new “rules” page, they still permit some dubious activities:


            “Videos and testimonials containing actors who portray consumers and describe their success using the product…”

            And they’ve gone all out to “curtail” the upselling and downselling trickery. Look at this new “limitation”…

            NOT ALLOWED:

            “More than 3 upsells (one time offers) and two exit offers for each sales flow.”

            Wow. So the tricky to navigate popups-from-hell gauntlet has been reduced to merely 5? I guess coming down from 13 that might be impressive. That’s sure to be helpful to grandmothers with I.T. degrees.

            Last but not least, after years of allowing festering parasites and scam operators free reign, ClickBank makes this revealing statement:

            “It is generally unreasonable to assume that someone with little or no experience in internet marketing can achieve a 6-figure income with an hour or less of effort per day. It is more reasonable to assume that with attention, effort, and spare time, the average person with little or no internet marketing experience can achieve a supplemental income.”

            This isn’t a conclusion that a mult-million dollar parasitic funnel operation just suddenly makes after many years in business. It’s something that would be apparent early on.

            ClickBank is, to quote the scientific term, “The Devil.”

            1. @Frank, @SD, You’ve convinced me. Not that I really needed a whole lot of convincing that ClickBank’s “new” guidelines are mere window dressing. And I wish I could say that my previous comment was sarcasm, which might make me appear a little smarter, but the truth was that I was actually wondering, for a brief and rare moment of suspended cynicism, if MAYBE ClickBank was belatedly trying to do the right thing. I’ll own up to my misjudgment. Even cynics occasionally trip up.

              I wonder how long the perps of “how-to-get-rich-thru-ClickBank” frauducts, such as the one I mentioned and linked to in my first comment, will be allowed to continue using “the Devil” to push their hundreds of worthless little schemes. Perhaps the frauduct to which I linked is merely a last-minute money grab before the whole shebang gets shut down.

              One can imagine the cigar-and-booze infested “mastermind” session that gave rise to that frauduct. “Hey, Joe, no tellin’ what the FTC is gonna do about ClickBank, but meanwhile, they have those cool new ‘rules’ up there to make ’em look more legit, so let’s milk it.” “Hey, Pat, now THAT’S an inspired idea.”

              What they may have working in their favor, besides their own seemingly boundless creativity, is the FTC’s already over-full plate.

  11. Professional Marketing International
    3049 Executive Pkwy,
    Lehi, UT 84043-4698
    801-341-3779 fax

    Secondary Location:
    8010 E McDowell
    Scottsdale, AZ 85257

    Steve Thorne (President and CEO)
    Marque “Q” Trosper (VP Customer Relations)
    Phil Smith (President)
    Len Page (Vice President)
    Doug Gerrard (Manager)

    Products & Services

    “According to information provided by the company they are a direct marketing organization contracted by outside companies to market to client databases. The company markets business opportunity consulting services by telephone as well as other business development products”

    356 complaints recorded with the BBB (considering most people probably don’t complain, that’s HUGE!)

    NOTE: This operation is listed as a “member” of the BBB, and has been given an A- rating. If you go to that URL above, and click on the link near the bottom where it says, “Industry Comparison Chart,” look at what the BBB says are “normal” complaint figures. It’s only a FRACTION of what these people have!

    How on EARTH can they remotely “qualify” for an A- rating? Oh, that’s right. You can BUY the BBB ratings. If you’re reading this, please shoot the Utah BBB a quick email, including that link, and ask them about their “rating” of this boiler room compared to the “industry norm.” Email:

    1. @Utah BBB loves boiler rooms too ::

      I’ll bet if they’re for sale :: they’re cheap.

      The recent ABC News BBB expose thing made it look like you could get a good rating for a couple of thousand max.

      Of course for a normal small business that’s awful :: but for scammers it’s chump change … and a great investment.

  12. Look at the list of “members” of the “Alliance for Lifelong Learning” (a lobbyist group in Washington, DC):

    “We are your resource for identifying reputable companies that will provide education and hands-on learning to help you achieve your goals and dreams…”

    Oh, and they actually conducted a meeting in our nation’s capitol building:


    1. @Influence 101,


      Are these double-bonus links?…
      United States Of America vs. Business Recovery Services, LLC
      Reply in Support of Plaintiff’s Motion for Preliminary Injunction

      #5 at the end of the complaint-paper says to us that United States Of America is trying to recover from the recoverer:

      “Award such relief as this Court finds necessary to redress injury
      to consumers resulting from Defendants’ violations of the
      Telemarketing Sales Rule and the FTC Act, including, but not
      limited to, rescission or reformation of contracts, restitution, the
      refund of monies paid, and the disgorgement of ill-gotten

      I don’t see anything after 3/29/2011 from this one:

      1. @Jack, If you can’t trust the people that offer to help you with people you can’t trust, who then can you trust?

          1. @Jack, The same Mr. “S.” Martin also taught me everything you need to know about goal setting. He said it’s best to start with a smaller, more attainable goal first, and then work your way up to bigger ones. He said for that first goal he decided to become the all knowing, all being, master of time, space, and dimension. After that, he wanted to go to Europe.

    1. @Aristoletes Italia, You would be functionally better off losing your fascination with the perceived cleverness of questionable actions, and instead focusing on “intent” as well as “harm.”

      It doesn’t take a “genius” to selectively disregard society’s norms and acceptable standards, it simply takes a self-centered sociopath. If that’s your aspiration, this is the wrong place to profess your reverence. On the other hand, maybe you are simply being an antogonistic asshole for sport.

      1. @Phil, are you a psychologist to tell that someone is a psychopath just by watching a video of him?

        1. @Aristoletes Italia, I didn’t “just watch a video.” I have a dedicated inbox overflowing with YEARS worth of directly sent emails, coordinated emails from syndicate members, and emails from foolish “B Team” affiliates. I’ve done plenty of homework.

          I’ve also watched numerous videos and listened to more than enough audios to see things for what they really are.

          You see, SD is not alone in his dislike for what’s rotten in this world, and there are quite a few of us taking notes and digging deeper right alongside him. He’s got more behind the scenes supporters than the charlatans could possibly imagine.

          You, on the other hand, are either one very deluded individual, or as I said previously, simply an antagonistic asshole. The latter at least now appears to be a given since you appear to be ignoring overwhelming reality by choice, rather than ignorance.

        2. @Aristoletes Italia,

          Good One! Like Psychologist’s, Psychiatrist’s or any kind of Psych know’s shit about the brain, behaviour, blah, blah, blah, really. Ooops, can of worms!

          1. @Juice, Except you don’t need to be a shrink to know Frank Kern and the rest of those lowlifes are douchebags.

    2. @Aristoletes Italia ::

      I’ll bet Irwin remembers a time not so long ago when everyone thought he was cool. Nice ladies and gentlemen deceived … con man super fun time America #1!

      But now it’s dwindled to just a couple of residue fleabags with borderline personalities {that’s you!} drowning in the wake of his weak ass bullshit.

  13. Am I the only one checking here every day waiting for the next post about these guys to get published?

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