The M Word

foreshadowing the robot

Manipulation :: if you act now :: for the whole family … and you can too!

A lot of weak and wimpy shiteaters out there think that manipulation is a bad thing :: but spider monster Naomi Dunford knows better …

… infantile manipulation …

See :: everybody’s a master manipulator :: even PreemieJack and the other lil’ babies out there …

… fucking propagandists one and all.

Baby after baby demanding that their basic human needs be met by the person responsible for meeting those needs. It’s sick.

Dave Navarro released a blogging about blogging frauduct called :: More Buyers Mastermind

“14 of the web’s top influencers share their six- and seven-figure strategies”

Brian Clark

Naomi Dunford

Chris Brogran

Yaro Starak

Marie Forleo

Darren Rowse

Alexis Neely

Danielle Laporte

Laura Roeder

Andrea J. Lee

Tina Forsyth

Clay Colins

Lynn Terry

Johnny B. Truant

For just $397 you can listen to Dave :: pretending to be an Internet success :: interviewing other fucknuts who are pretending to be Internet successes. Maybe if you pay to listen to enough phone calls between pretend successes :: you will have you some real success … I guess that’s how it works.

… maybe the advice is dumb …

“You’re rich … I’m rich” :: says Naomi knowing that neither one of them are rich. It seems manipulative to sell an expensive product to the inexperienced based on completely false pretenses :: and it is :: but manipulation is totally cool now …

… manipulating manipulation …

Naomi was doing an expensive product for “life coaches” :: so she took the time to look up the word manipulation in the dictionary before she told people they should be doing more of it. Turns out :: only one of the definitions of manipulation is bad … manipulation is “generally totally ethically neutral.”

According to the New Oxford American Dictionary …

manipulate |məˈnipyəˌlāt|

verb [ with obj. ]

1 handle or control (a tool, mechanism, etc.), typically in a skillful manner: he manipulated the dials of the set.

• alter, edit, or move (text or data) on a computer.

• examine or treat (a part of the body) by feeling or moving it with the hand: a system of healing based on manipulating the ligaments of the spine.

2 control or influence (a person or situation) cleverly, unfairly, or unscrupulously: the masses were deceived and manipulated by a tiny group.

• alter (data) or present (statistics) so as to mislead.

The lying cow mouth is right :: only one of the definitions of manipulation is bad … the one that’s applicable.

If it’s okay to manipulate clay into an ashtray :: or a Number1Dad coffee mug :: then it must also be okay to manipulate a 55 year-old divorcee out of all the money she has left in the world. The many blessings of psychopathic equivalency.

Manipulate or fail.

… love story …

In hindsight that seems like foreshadowing …

>> bleep bloop

212 thoughts on “The M Word”

    1. @Spider Alarm ::

      I knew that was gonna get voted down … cause it sounds pretty sexist.

      He wrote a booked called The Bitch … and now he’s pitching himself as a motivational speaker …

      I prefer to get my info on bitches from non-motivational speakers.

      1. @SD,

        Well said, Salty. I think. Or does me agreeing with that mean I’m sexist (because you sort of implied that some women are bitches)? Dammit.

        So many parts of mainstream culture still seem to condone and even encourage sexism by men against women that sometimes I can’t tell if I’m doing it on accident.

        Oh well. At least I know not to sneak up behind my female co-workers and hug them from behind or some shit like that.

        I think sexism is bad and wrong. And I also think that so long as we have very rigid, specific concepts of femininity and masculinity ingrained in our culture we are going to have problems with sexism going both directions.

        I ramble. I philosophize.

        Furry cows moo and decompress.

      2. @SD,

        To me Roy looks pretty perky and in one piece–so my bet is that he has yet to come across a really dangerous woman. Or at least, he has yet to raise the ire of a really dangerous woman.

        There are still opportunities though, particularly if he touts this stuff to all and sundry around the motivational circuit.

  1. Naomi Dunford believes infants manipulate their parents? I guess it makes it easier to abandon your children when you view them from birth onwards as manipulative little bastards.

    Sane and loving Mothers view their interactions with their infants as a loving back and forth communication, these Mothers don’t see their babies as manipulating them…they see them as responding to them.

    This explains so much about Dunford’s ability to shed her children when they become dead weight and inconvenient to her lifestyle. She sees herself in an adversarial relationship with them from the moment of birth. Dunford doesn’t know what love is, everything is a zero sum game to her.

    1. @Barbara,

      On the one hand, I get what you’re saying; on the other hand… I dunno.

      My son (love of my life, pain of my ass) turned 14 yesterday. He’s a great student, has a fantastic, slightly twisted sense of humor, and is generally an all-around great kid.

      When he was five months old, he started teething. Evidently, teething hurts a lot (I don’t remember, so I’m basing this statement on Sonny’s behavior at the time). Every night, for two weeks, he awakened, crying in pain, poor thing. And every night, I went in, picked him up, rocked him, put some baby orajel on his little gums, and sang to him until he went back to sleep.

      Fast forward another two weeks: it occurs to then-hubby and me that Sonny wasn’t crying any more so much as he was simply yelling. The little sucker was playing us: he’d found a way to get attention, even in the middle of the night, and he was going to use it, by God!

      Now: do I think that he consciously came up with this nefarious plan to get between me and the sweet, sweet rest I so desperately needed? Nope. But definitely, Baby Boy had hit on a strategy that worked.

      So, yeah, infants (older ones, anyway) absolutely can be manipulative. However, as several folks have pointed out, using a proven strategy to get one’s basic needs met using a proven strategy to screw over other people’s minds to the point where they give up their life savings to chase unicorns.

      1. Dammit, somehow part of what I wrote got stripped out. I guess the ‘bot doesn’t like mathematical operators? ;-)

        Anyway, that last paragraph should read, in part, “…using a proven strategy to get one’s basic needs met *is not equal to* using a proven strategy to screw over other people’s minds to the point where they give up their life savings to chase unicorns.”

      2. @Kathleen,

        Babies and toddlers are completely egocentric, not because they’re selfish, manipulative bastards or brilliant strategists, but because their brains haven’t developed enough to see from others’ perspectives. Ever seen the indignant look on a two-year-old’s face when the five-year-old he just bit bites him back? Why did that happen? Objects aren’t supposed to behave like that! What do you mean he’s also a person like me and feels pain when bit? No comprende.

        Naomi’s claiming she’s operating at a two-year-old’s level. There’s a word for that. Retarded.

        1. @Lanna,

          Hey Neigh Owwe………….. Me!

          General Unicorn here.

          So impressed by your story about peeing in a jug in your kitchen I decided to poop in my own stall this morning.

          ha ha ha ha ha… I’m going to blahhahhhahhhgggg about it tomorrow! just want to say thanks for the high-brow content ideas.

          Rock your Dave,
          The General

  2. Dave says:

    “I guess you could say I’m a bit of a nerd, because I’m a little obsessive about studying how people think and what motivates people to buy. The only other thing I’m really obsessive about, though, is choosing only classy people to work with. (None of those yellow-highlighter sales page types with their smarmy used-car salesman tactics.)

    What this means for you is that you’re going to be learning “clean” business building strategies you can use in the real world, without resorting to any cheap tricks or questionable tactics.”

    Yeah, sure Dave, “clean” strategies. Every single one of those supposed Masterminds should have their faces on wanted posters in your local post office. A scummier, scammier group would be hard to find.

    Stay classy Dave…

    1. @Barbara, exactly. That’s why it is so important to feature this B team. They make a point of saying “we’re not those guys” and then feed their acolytes the same yellow highlighter BS in a magenta, black and white format with hipster photos from Flickr. Same wolf, new sheepskin.

  3. “Inherent in the human condition is manipulaton” says Naomi. She then proceeds to give examples of what she thinks proves her claim. But her examples are ludicrous. She says that her own mother buying light reflecting paint to make a small room appear larger is , in Naomi’s words “manipulating herself”. She then gives example after example of communications which she labels “manipulation”. It reminds me of the old saying that if the only tool you have is a hammer everything you see is a nail. Because Dunford views every single interaction with another human being, including infants, as a possibility to manipulate them she assumes everyone else shares her sick, twisted worldview.

    This is where Naomi’s lack of formal education becomes a glaring deficit. Dunford would flunk an introduction to logic course. She makes obvious mistakes in reasoning but is unable to see the tenuousness of her own position.

    Naomi, you are not a tenth as smart as you think you are, I hope you enjoy prison.

    1. @Barbara,

      Naomi actually believes she’s an expert…when in fact she is just manipulating others for financial benefit

      Not knobs on a TV manipulation, lie to get money manipulation.

      1. @Shit Storm, Yea she only wishes she was famous enough to be one of those knobs you see on TV. Oh wait

  4. I was just browsing the sites of Alexis Neely, formerly of Munger, Tolles&Olson, now with her finger in many little pies. She bills herself as a “Truth-Telling Lawyer and Evolutionary Strategist”. Reading the jargon at her site is nauseating. She uses phrases like ” doing relationship ” and ” transition our relationship”.

    You can click on her “Wanna Partner with Me?” and discover all of the ways Alexis can part you from your money. There is:

    1. Invest in the intentional community/farm I am creating in Colorado

    Send money.

    2. Become an affiliate of my Money Map and/or LIFT programs and get paid to tell your community about my courses.

    Sign up and send money.

    3. Hire me to coach/consult you.

    Send money NOW. Forget you ever heard of Tim Brownson.

    She says of herself: “From legal disputes to scams national legal expert Alexis Martin Neely will bring a fresh perspective to your next family, money or law segment!”

    I’ll bet she knows all about scams, she’s an expert on that after knowing Naomi and Dave and the rest of the powder monkey’s from that entire pirate crew.

      1. @SD,

        Yep, that blew me away. Home of Truck D’oh! and Louie Louie of the seven hour talk marathon. (Did you know he had his face frozen half off and mean old Truck wouldn’t let him talk about it?)

        Speaking of Munger&Co., is that fucking muderous bastard EVER going to get sentenced?!! The last I heard it was now on for Saturday November 19th but I’m sure that’ll get pushed back.

      1. @MKR,

        You have no idea! She’s holed up there with her children, new boyfriend, and up until he took a powder, her alcoholic ex-boyfriend who stole from her before splitting. There seem to be at least 2 or 3 other hangers on.

        Of course, the ex was one of the people who helped care for her children. You know, it takes a village and all that.

    1. @Barbara,

      I’ve been meaning to write to Salty about Alexis Neely. Turns out she’s $400,000 in debt and isn’t sure whether she’s going to pay it or not.

      And she’s OK with that because she has done more than $400,000 worth of “good things” with that money. Like really, really helping people. Besides, the system is corrupt and all that, so why should we be beholden to a corrupt system?

      1. @Jane Galt, Alexis Neely is worth digging into.. some cracy stuff… with the “eyes wide open” cult she’s hanging out with (paying her) Sorry to see such talent [Alexis Neely] get so wierd…. and 400k dept? That’s sad.

        1. @Anonymous

          Yeah, she seemed very driven, ambitious and together when she first starting running her online business. Then she shelled out $100,000 for Alexandria Brown’s platinum mastermind group, ended up over $400,000 in debt, and now admits to having a marijuana addiction.

          And someone would pay her for advice, why?

          1. @Jane Gault, Is there some kind of weird cult-like shit going on with that Mastermind group? Alexis Neely isn’t the first woman who seemed be pretty sensible and to have a real business model who suddenly went seriously fruit-loopy after getting involved with that group.

    2. @Barbara,

      She bills herself as a “Truth-Telling Lawyer and Evolutionary Strategist”

      I’m kind of surprised she doesn’t mention her LOA ways….She also claims to be a manifestering attorney [[International Association of Law of Attraction professional]]….I mentioned her manifestering ways when she was Shifting [[femininely]] with Andros/Sumpters micro endeavor…

      Alexis attributes everything she has manifested to the Law of Attraction and looks forward to sharing the specifics of that with you here.


      1. @_cartman_,

        It’s hard to believe there could be something called the “International Association of Law of Attraction Professionals”. Alexis wrote this heartfelt collection of cliches on their website:

        “I’m throwing down the gauntlet and taking a stand, walking my talk, closing a door, trusting my path, focusing on the people I absolutely love to serve and allowing plenty of time and space for my soul to evolve.”

        “This is my public declaration so I can stop talking about it and finally do it.”

        “And so it is.”

        Isn’t that beautiful? The last time I read something that awe-inspiring was a fortune cookie that said “the busboy spit in your egg drop soup”.

        1. @Barbara,

          Somewhere it was mentioned that she had a marijuana problem. Assuming that’s the case: she’s just high. She gets high, then she blogs. That fluff is the result.

          And it would just be fluff too except that she’s associated with shady people. So her fluffy, newage stuff can be the chrome that makes a lot of icky stuff look shiny.

          Furry cows moo and decompress.

    3. @Barbara, Not long ago, Alexis was apparently dating some small time marketer in Georgia, and he was flying cross country to be with her on weekends. The poor schmuck was obviously smitten, and tweeting about the “love of his life.” You could almost smell from her corresponding tweets that he was a placeholder.

      1. @Carl,

        That is sad, I wonder how much money she bilked out of him? But being a short-termer in the life of someone like Alexis would be good news. I feel sorrier for those who can’t escape, like dependent children.

      2. @Carl,

        Yeah, right after the marketer (Dave Dee) she married a guy at Burning Man. I don’t think the marriage lasted a year and he didn’t take it very well. I believe he was also involved in her business or had started to be.

        1. @Jane Galt,

          Dave Dee was part of the Dan Kennedy gang.

          And he was one of the guys who spoke at Ken McCarthy’s System Seminar. She was his unknown sidekick claiming to be a success thanks to him. The success they shared included harvesting lawyer emails from the Internet and spamming them to attend a teleseminar pitch by Alexis.

          Dave Dee got pwned.

          If you want see how, look at the Google cache for

          Here is part of it: “Within 8 weeks, she did her first teleseminar launch and sold $117,000 of her product. This is still the best business day of my life. She was screaming, crying and laughing as she watched the orders poured in. It was a transformation experience for her as well as me. Within three weeks had sold over $225,o00.

          As our business relationship developed so did our personal relationship. And soon, we were both deeply in love.”

          That Dave Dee has taken down this page probably means he discovered that Alexis was “deeply in love” with the $225,000 and not him.

          To sum it all up.

          Alexis wanted to join the gurus. She latched on to Dave Dee and his Dan Kennedy connections. He got sex. She got a start.

          When it was time to move up, Alexis paid Ali Brown, another Dan Kennedy protege, $100,000 for entry to the IM women’s empowerment inner circle.

          If you were an IM guru, would you rather have sex with Alexis or the $100,000?

          There are plenty of Alexis stories in the IM world. Bridges have been burned.

            1. @SD,

              The most hilarious comment on that weeping violins break-up page had to be the one by Franc that gave us a look at Dave Dee’s humble beginnings:

              “Hi Dave,
              I met you once in 1999 in LA back when you were doing the marketing conferences for magicians. That conference and your marketing course (it was your first product) changed my life. I went from being a magician to a marketer of entertainment/magic services.”

              That is so fucking funny! Marketing for magicians, do you mean driving around with your name painted on the side of your van isn’t enough anymore? It reminds me of a local magician whose card I saw once in a client’s rolodex. Written on his business card, right below Available for Birthday Parties and Bar & Bat Mitzvahs was “keep him away from the bar!!!”

            2. When the world doesn’t completely shift to a hippie love in on December 12 2012 I’m sure she and dozens of other new agers are going to be crying into their dashikis.

          1. @ Anonymous,

            There are so many nutjob blog posts on there! If I get a chance this weekend, I’ll find the best and nuttiest and post them here.

          2. @Anonymous, Jane Galt, Barbara, etc., Did these clowns ever get married legally before “transitioned” their relationship to not so married? I don’t imagine that being at Burning Man, they had time to leave and get a marriage license in time for the ceremony, though I have no doubt there were enough internet ordained idiots available to perform the ceremony at Burning Man.

            @Anonymous, the comments on that entry are interesting. Some quite critical and reasonably so.

            1. @Anna,

              I don’t see how there possibly could have been time to attend to the legal niceties since Alexis wrote:

              “That morning at the Temple, he asked me to marry him.

              And I said yes!

              Within a few hours, an engagement ceremony had been suggested, which then quickly turned into a wedding ceremony!”

              She doesn’t strike me as the kind of woman who would let a minor detail like the lack of a marriage license stand in the way of true love. I think it’s hilarious that she travels with a wedding dress to Burning Man “just in case”. ( boy, and I thought I overpacked)

              The funniest comment had to be this:

              “Oh pluh-eze! Grow up you hippie wannabes. Woodstock was a one time event, it’s done! Move on. Burning Man is just a poor imitation. Just like that faux marriage. How can you expect a lifelong union when the groom dresses like Sgt. Pepper?!”

            2. @Barbara

              Yeah, hippie wannabes is the right word. These people never in their lives gave a shit about the things that hippies truly stand for. Alexis’s ex husband looks like he just traded in his business suit for some shamanic designer garb:


              He is way too manicured to be a hippie.

              I actually wanted to attend Burning Man sometime, but I’m starting to wonder if that’s a good idea, considering that all these scammers are there tainting it and treating it like a Halloween party.

              Apparently, Eben Pagan was also there dishing out free advice about “conscious business”:


              Barf. I can’t believe he is trying to position himself as some sort of world-changing entrepreneur. And these Burning Man losers were just lapping it up.

  5. @One Percenter, Whoa shit! Well THAT sure didn’t come out in a cleverly-worded email! You do have to wonder if she finally figured it out. Man, these unicorns are hitting everybody…

  6. @One Percenter, Frank Kern is despicable, but your link shows that Frank is the “petitioner” and India is the “respondent” which suggests that HE filed.

  7. Also on the Mastermind list is Andrea Lee. She’s connected to CoachVille and Dave Buck. There’s an interesting account on Ripoff Report about a man who was screwed over by Dave Buck. He paid $895 for a lifetime membership that Dave Buck revoked.

    “So just by starting up a competing site, I lose out on $895 I paid Thomas Leonard but since Buck is running the ship, there’s no recourse. On a call, Dave Buck was talking with Andrea Lee the former GM of coachville while Leonard was still alive. Buck was talking about how he and Lee had a falling out and now they’re mending the past. Buck mentioned that he’s a coach, modeling peacemakers.”

    Trying to understand Andrea Lee’s site is like trying to nail jello to a wall. It’s filled with amorphous, meaningless jargon and statements like:

    “Key #1: Understand FULLY that you can’t give away what you don’t have.”

    “If you want to be generous, you must be wealthy. If you want to be attractive, you must have plenty. If you want to change lives, you must have reserve.”

    “If you want to be a coach, you must be coachable.”

    “In other words, stop being wishy washy about money. Make sure you are sure, in no uncertain terms, that you want to be a financially well-off actively practicing coach.”

    There, that’s clear as a bell. Did you all get that? There’s plenty more where that came from…but you’ll have to pay for it. This taste was free.

    Sign up to receive the full five lessons of this ecourse at

    1. @Barbara,

      Coachville overpromised and undelivered. Ironically, one of Thomas Leonard’s attraction principles centered around underpromising and

    2. @Barbara,

      Also ironically, “you can’t give away what you don’t have” is why “coachsultants” who don’t have real training or genuine experience can’t give any actual expertise.

  8. The way they hook you is by creating dissatisfaction within your heart that has no place existing there and then replacing the void they’ve created with this fantasy lifestyle where you get to “fire your boss” and strike out into the wild, wild frontier along with a posse of super-cool, renegade hyper-achievers.

    Your posse (or tribe, in their parlance) will surround and protect you from all those who seek to limit your potential (including your family). You’ll become rich. You’ll work from home in your pajamas. You won’t ever had to take SHIT from some anyone again. You’ll finally be your own man–you’ll take the day off and head to the beach whenever you want; your followers will adore you; you’ll have more time for your family; and you’ll never have to worry about money again.

    That’s what they sell.

    What they don’t tell you is that entrepreneurialism is high-risk and requires far more work than most people put into their 9-5 jobs. It’s also something that not everyone is cut out for.

    But here’s the really insidious part–they make you feel as though your perfectly normal life marks you as a failure … as if going getting up everyday and going to a job you don’t much care for in order to support your family is somehow dishonorable.

    Well, it isn’t. Here’s a fact–very few people love their jobs. That’s why it’s called “work.” And there’s nothing wrong with living a life that isn’t filled with riches and excitement.

    Success is not a destination. Most of us live rather mundane lives filled with responsibility and obligation. That doesn’t make them worthless or without merit.

    To the contrary, you carve your mark onto this world in the spaces in between–in the quiet moments and in many small and unseen ways. You do this when tossing a football with your son. You do it when supporting and comforting your spouse after a tough day at work … or by providing a friend with a piece of wisdom forged out of your own deep personal failings that helps him see a bad situation in a different light.

    We’d all like to feel like the captain of our own ships at all times, but this isn’t how life works. There are times when eating shit from your boss doesn’t make you less of a man … it makes you MORE because you took that abuse for the right reason.

    When you cut through all the bullshit that people sling at you, it really boils down to one simple idea. Life is about trade-offs. Every gain requires a counterbalancing sacrifice. It’s not so much about how you live, but what you can live WITH.

    Mature, healthy adults understand this. And understand how to find satisfaction within imperfection.

    The IM crowd seeks to turn otherwise decent souls into gluttonous, grasping, imbalanced, greed-zombies. That they do it by corrupting positive, uplifting ideals makes it all the more despicable.

    It’s not just that their lies empty accounts; it’s that they bankrupt souls as well.

    1. @Mad Max, Wow! Truly the most dead-on, solid, reality-based comment I’ve ever seen here. What @Sundog said: you NAILED it.

    2. @Mad Max, Brav-theF-O. I couldn’t have said it better myself.

      “The way they hook you is by creating dissatisfaction within your heart that has no place existing there and then replacing the void they’ve created with this fantasy lifestyle where you get to “fire your boss” and strike out into the wild, wild frontier along with a posse of super-cool, renegade hyper-achievers.”

      YES! Everyone hates their day jobs from time to time – but at least it’s consistent income. At least it’s allowing you to feed your family and not encouraging you to abandon them. Having a perfectly normal life is NOT a failure. Life requires trade offs by it’s very nature or we’d all be alone in the wilderness fending for ourselves instead of living in a community.

      1. @LisaSimpson,

        I want to add something to this … because I don’t want to appear unsympathetic towards people who are struggling to make ends meet.

        When I say that IMers create dissatisfaction where none should exist, I’m NOT talking about legitimate money worries.

        It’s a brutal economy and a lot of people are in a bad spot right now. Sometimes serious financial problems become the gateway to the IM world

        And so, yes, that’s a piece of the puzzle. But if you listen carefully to the pitch, it’s not about making ends meet–it’s about achieving freedom from normal, everyday worries.

        That’s the real lie.

        Because if you need just a few more hundred dollars a month to make ends meet, you’ll have far more success picking up another part time job. And if you don’t have time for that, then you CERTAINLY don’t have time to start a small business from scratch.

        Even if you assume that IM is a legitimate business model, there is nothing more difficult, frustrating, time consuming, and high-risk than running your own business.

        Being your own boss requires a particular set of personal attributes. For the most part, entrepreneurs are NATURALLY inclined toward this kind of work and usually begin from a young age.

        It’s almost as if they don’t have a choice.

        The rest of us are NOT wired for this lifestyle. Can it be coached into us? I can’t say for sure that it can’t, but I have serious doubts.

        All of us can improve on our weaknesses, but we are, at our core, what we are. You can’t make an apple pie out of a handful of carrots.

        But that doesn’t mean there’s anything wrong with carrots. Carrot cake is pretty good, too.

        1. @Mad Max, Beautifully made posts from you. Here’s to 43-HUNDRED thumbs up on your amazing posts which makes the summary-explanation to answer WHY so much about Dumsford and the Navarros (in addition to the reason of bringing a Dad back to the kids).

    3. @Mad Max and Salty and the crew

      Yes. Yes. And yes. The manipulation is systematic. They start by kicking your ass for being a ‘Regular Joe’ or ‘Jane’, and then the tentacles latch on for the rip-off ride.

      I’m a smart cookie, and when I was feeling low and depressed about work et al. even I (I am very critical and skeptical of these online things) started to go ‘hmmm, maybe there’s something to this’. That’s when I had a $99 lapse in judgement and bought a frauduct from Megan Elizabeth Morris (highly backed by Naomi Scumford) – an mp3 and booklet mess that, really, was more like one of my underwhelming high school English projects.

      The more I read about this stuff, the more I understand it as one gigantic Sly and the Family Stone circle jerk. These people have to work in packs to lend each other fake credibility. If they worked alone, people would easily scoff and reject their bullshit at face value.

      Some of these people would be far better trying their hand at dimestore fiction, but thanks to the Internets this has become the plague of all plagues next to child porn, sex trafficking, and all manner of sickening crap.

      Thanks again Mad Max, for very sharply bringing into view what I wish so many others would see.

      I count myself lucky that I didn’t fall for more crap (don’t get me started on Havi Brooks and her rubber ducky).

      1. @BananaTaco, Oh there’s a fruit loop! (Havi) because business = dancing = yoga = awesome (or something like that)

    4. @Mad Max,
      +44 and counting, and well deserved. :-)

      @SD I hope you find a way to enshrine @Mad Max’s post in an article sometime. It’s really that good.

      Furry cows moo and decompress.

      1. @Wyrd ::

        Yeah it’s really good. It’s enshrined on this post though. Lots of people read these comments … it’s one of the super cool things about the site. I contribute more than half of my content to the comments … and the comments make up the vast majority of the total content. The commenters have been quoted elsewhere about as frequently as I have. Many people come just for comments and don’t really care for me.

        So anywayz :: don’t hold your breath. The @SlowlyWaking speaking of spiders thing all you new peeps just witnessed …

        … was part of a post-ShitStorm tradition …

        1. @SD,

          Lots of people read these comments

          Hey, you know what’s really funny? People read the ‘hidden’ comments, but usually skip over the ones which are voted up! Nobody reads Barbara’s endless blabbering, or the those incomprehensible Cartman comments, but everyone reads the hidden gems!

          1. @Orenthal,

            Well, there could well be a person on here called “Nobody” who does not read the visible comments.

            But from the look of the responses, loads of others do!

            1. @Yakaru, Yup- sometimes ya just have to bite the bullet and read the strange, sicko down-voted comments in order to fully appreciate the up-voted ones… Looking at the hidden comments is also good if you ever start to think people like Barbara are over-reacting and nobody could really be as weird and crazy as their comments seem to suggest IMers are.

          2. @Orenthal, You speak only for yourself. I love Barbara’s comments and very much look forward to the gems she dredges up from Lord knows where. Seems others do too, since she’s been (a) complimented on her comments (b) others reply with favorable responses to her comments and (c) they annoy you enough that you singled her out. Ha!

            1. @Anna,

              Thanks! If I were an Internet Marketer I could’ve used Orenthal’s words as a testimonial. “Barbara’s Endless Blabbering” a comment for any occasion! For $497 I’ll send you my ebook on the subject! But if it makes him feel better to think only hidden comments are read, well, that’s great too. It means PZ Myers efforts to pharyngulate my comments failed, because according to Orenthal everybody reads the hidden gems. Great news!

    5. @Mad Max, THE single, most stunning and poignant shard of clarity to appear on a blog filled lots of them.

      One to save, repeat and share in the SD Hall Of Fame…..

  9. I am wondering what the dirt is on Lynn Terry. I thought she was legit. I have noticed that she loves to brag about her lifestyle as an affiliate marketer, though.

    1. @, Lynn Terry is one of Ed Dale’s female team of manipulators and from dwellers. That’s pretty conclusive proof that she’s a con artist and in no way legit.

      1. @Ed Dale Scam, She’s in the WAHM mommybusiness affiliate marketing crowd that also includes:

        Alice Seba
        Nicole Brown

        and a few others. Basically same shit just positioned for suburban stay at home moms who want to live the IM lifestyle.

    2. Lynn Terry is nauseating. Met her once (and that was once too often) in person – she is sickening! And a presumptious, braggart liar.

  10. Naomi is no spider.

    But I’m pretty sure she’s Saruman’s sister. If you read the book, there’s a chapter where Saruman makes his last stand with words. I’ve always loved that chapter as the “textbook” example of what salesperson style manipulation sounds like when it’s happening to you.

    Everything Saruman says is a lie, but it’s said using pieces of things that are all-true or half-true.

    @SD: You are, of course, correct about the word “manipulation”.

    But, from Naomi’s jacked up point of view–she didn’t use the word “manipulation” incorrectly–she merely manipulated the word “manipulation”‘s meaning to suit her needs! A perfect example of applying her principle, and (I hope) an illustration of how dumb it is. Yeah, not just wrong and evil, but also dumb.

    The word Naomi might have used instead is something like “influence“. That word is slightly more neutral in connotation. Naomi also does a logical fallacy thing (I’m not sure which one it is, but it’s got to be one of the ones with a name): she implies that since “everyone manipulates [or influences] those around them–even babies do it!” then that must therefore mean that manipulation (and this time we are referring specifically to the dictionary definition) is perfectly ok.

    Thing is, we squishy humans wouldn’t have come up with all the different words “influence”, “manipulation”, “control”, “domination”, “persuasion”, “guidance”, “direction”, etc if all of them were exactly the same. No those words (some of them anyway) might be synonyms, yet that doesn’t mean they mean exactly the same. (I’m pedantic by nature.) That only means they mean almost exactly the same thing.

    Naomi will gloss over any distinction in meaning if it gets in the way of her One True Goal: Look out for Number One.

    But humans are social creatures. And if all you’re ever doing is manipulating everyone around you like puppets on strings, how can you ever have any real friends? Worse–what kind of folks are you going to have around you? What surely nothing but more people who are trying to do the exact same thing–that is people who are trying to manipulate you just as you are trying to manipulate them. That’s not friendship that’s just a never ending dance with hungry sharks. Why the fuck would anyone want to do that?

    Oh wait, I know–two reasons:
    1) because Naomi either doesn’t understand or doesn’t know what friendship actually is
    2) because Naomi is the special kind of smart that has the fatally stupid flaw: she honestly believes she can outsmart all the other sharks. Yes. She believes she’s better than all the others… just like all the others do.

    Naomi, your staff is broken! And don’t even think about running off to the Shire. We’ve got that one covered too.

    Furry cows moo and decompress.

    1. @Wyrd,

      It’s a red herring fallacy. The use of babies – who unconsciously are asking for their basic needs to be met, distracts from the real issue of conscious, premeditated manipulation.

      1. @Patrick,

        Thanks, that helps. Yeah, she’s essentially making the argument that a baby’s unconscious need to have its basic needs met is the same as her willfully manipulating someone into doing what she wants them to. And, although I do not recall her explicitly saying so, it’s pretty clear from her attitude and from the dozens of things @Barbara has brought up that Naomi is arguing that it is perfectly ok to mislead people if doing so will aid in the manipulation process.

        Me? Yeah, I can be selfish and all, but I’ve always been a pretty big believer in the Golden Rule. Yeah that may sound a bit cheese-y, but there it is.

        Naomi is really dumb. And the sad part is that later, when she has nothing left–once everything has turned to poop and ash, she’ll look around and not understand how it got that way. And she’ll blame The World. She will (incorrectly) feel that The World has out-manipulated her.

        The truth is just that forever re-defining things just to make the argument come out the way you want makes about as much sense as writing down made-up numbers on an accounting sheet. You can only do it for so long before the consequences of that sharp break with Actual Reality catch up with you in one manner or another.

        You could sort of think of that as the Natural Law of Karma. Or something. I dunno. I’d certainly bet on that over the Law of Attraction BS any day.

        Furry cows moo and decompress.

    2. @Wyrd,

      Its also a false analogy—-the fact that the survival of powerless babies depends on them getting food and sustenance from the parent by being compliant, bonding, smiling and generally pleasing the parent is not equivalent to a carte blanche to screw over every other vulnerable person you come across when you are an adult.

      Babies have evolved to use every instinct they have to ensure survival to adulthood. IM conmen aren’t in it for survival reasons, they are in it to get more ‘ego-power’– and the consumer goodies to trumpet that ‘power’— by deceitfully stealing other people’s money.

      Naomi could survive as an adult without employing deceitful manipulation, she just doesn’t want to and is rationalising (and thus excusing to herself and her audience) her sense of entitlement.

    3. @Wyrd ::

      But, from Naomi’s jacked up point of view–she didn’t use the word “manipulation” incorrectly–she merely manipulated the word “manipulation”‘s meaning to suit her needs!

      Yeah :: that’s why I called it “manipulating manipulation” … boom! One step ahead of you.

      There is doublespeak value to what she says … and I’ve heard it said many times before. Changing the definitions of words commonly levied as criticisms to special “insider only” definitions helps obscure truth and reinforce Us vs. Them.

      Here she is from that same interview saying “they have been conditioned” …

      … spider conditioning …

      “people have been trained”

      1. @SD, I don’t know if you create these videos or have someone else do them, but they are freakin’ brilliant!!

        This whole “we have them trained” crap also should be put on a t-shirt.

        “Following an Internet Marketing Guru? You’ve been TRAINED.”

        Maybe create a slang word, like “pwned” except it’s “tr8ned.”

        Training is for dogs. Educating is for people. Too many IMers look at their customers as though they’re lab rats. Gotta keep that wheel spinning!

  11. Tina Forsyth’s site had this entry:

    “Creating Your Own Certification Program”

    “Thanks for your interest, I’ll be in touch as we work out the details.
    Have an awesome day!

    That was seven months ago. Then nothing. I guess creating your own certification isn’t as easy as it sounds. But she did say:

    “You may have noticed that this blog is pretty quiet lately… but rest assured i’m not. I’ve been posting alot over at Online Business Manager- my site for finding, hiring or becoming an Online Business Manager.”

    Whew, that’s a relief. For a minute there I was afraid the world had lost one of it’s Masterminds.

  12. Lynn Terry wrote:

    “There is a little pocket of space on the internet known as the IM scene or the IM space where Internet Marketers of all skill levels congregate and talk among themselves. They network, tweet, blog, consume each other’s products & podcasts… and become so entrenched in the scene that they begin to believe they are “Internet Marketers” simply because they’re part of this ‘elite club’.”

    That’s shocking news! What sets Lynn Terry apart from these elitists?

    “I buy a lot of products online – and not just info products. I bought my dishwasher, computer desk, airline tickets, home decor, laptops, home electronics, patio set, gifts, etc online. I also sell these types of products online (as an affiliate). There’s more to Internet Marketing than ebooks and membership sites.”

    So, in other words, everyone who has ever made an online purchase is an Internet Marketer? And there is more to this than ebooks, there’s BarCamp, a chance to drink cheap beer and talk ‘bidness’ with other Internet Marketers.

    And if you’re really fortunate BarCamp might make you a sex expert, like Gina Parris:

    What more could you ask for from an event called BarCamp?

    1. Gina Parris …

      Performance Coach & Love Expert – uses Sports Psychology, Energy Therapy & Biblical Promises for a Love Life that’s Sizzling, Sexy & Sacred!

      1. @SD, are you kidding me?? Just when I thought these people couldn’t get anymore ridiculous. Being involved with Internet Marketing is worse than a crack addiction, burns up people’s minds to a charred crisp.

  13. Laura Roeder being interviewed by Steven A. Lowe:

    Steven: “What do you do specifically that’s different? There’s thousands of social media people out there, what makes you different?”

    Laura: “Yeah, so one thing that makes me different is I teach from the angle of what I call creating fame, and creating fame means being the number one go-to person in your field. So that might mean just in a small neighborhood, being the person that everybody knows, “Oh, if you need your lawn mowed, this is the guy that you go to,” and I’m all about using social media to create that presence, to create that reputation, and to bring in the testimonials, the leads, the credibility, to make yourself known as famous in your field.”

    Steven: “What do you not do that everyone else does?”

    Laura: “Well my company doesn’t do any implementation work, so that’s something I get asked about a lot, like will you set up my Twitter account, will you update Facebook for me? My company trains businesses who want and need to do it themselves.”


    Just when I think nothing these people can say will shock me I read something like this interview. “I teach from the angle of what I call…”
    Christ on a bicycle! That’s one of the worst pieces of gobbledygook I’ve ever read. This type of pretentious jargon is found at all of these scammer’s sites. It says nothing.

    She goes on to say her company does no implementation work because small companies need to do it for themselves. Which begs the question, what do you do? Tell people who the best guy for lawn mowing is? This is beyond absurd. Reading these sites is a depressing experience. None of them have anything of real, genuine value to offer. They make me ill…I guess that’s their single contribution. Virtual ipecac.

    1. @Barbara, It’s like they now’re the life-coach for business! – but not with having to help-business with the annoying cost-benefit analysis nuisance-piece.

    2. @Barbara,


      “What do you not do?”

      “Oh, anything measurable, concrete, useful…anything that requires performing some sort of action. I like to approach things from the angle of what I like to think of as empowering the small business to take action…like by telling them to take action! I figure if I tell them to take action over and over and over again then, in my own way, I feel like I’ve taken the biggest action of all, y’know? That’ll be $497”

      “And when someone pays you for advice, what kind of action do you suggest they take?”

      “I normally suggest paying me for more advice. The way I like to think about, and approach, and analyze, and crystallize, and formalize, and lobotomize this thinking, which is coming from the standpoint of what I like to think of as empowerment and financial freedom for small business owners, is that paying for more advice from me is the best, easiest step to having faith in themselves and their business. It’s like: if you don’t pay me for more advice, do you really believe in your own success? Why aren’t you willing to invest in yourself/me? Am I making sense here?”

      “No, but please take more of my money.”

      1. @208-577-6210 and Jack,

        Precisely! If you’re willing to pay for a stream of consciousness monologue from one of these idiots they’ll gladly spew this disjointed nonsense as long as your money holds out.

        But you’ll never receive anything “measurable, concrete, or useful” because they don’t have it to give.

    3. @Barbara, for the price that she charges for coaching, one could pay three people to do the implementation. read a book, go to Open forum or Inc or any other reputable website and then pay someone to do it yourself rather than buying from these schmoes.

      1. @LisaSimpson,

        I kinda enjoy how the IM “coaches” charge huge fees, and instruct their students to charge more than what they think they’re worth and oooh, don’t be afraid, because the universe smiles upon the bold and brave like that.

        But when it comes time to outsource various tasks and actually pay others for professional services, such as writing or design … THEN you try to get people to work for free, or give it to the lowest possible bidder.


        1. @mojo, I hear ya. That’s a scenario with which I am all too familiar, having dealt with it in one way or another for many years. It always makes me wonder if these New-Wage “coaches” are really too poor to afford professional creative services, or if they just seriously undervalue these services. Either way, the result is a lot of crappy, unprofessional product.

        2. @mojo, Right on! “I need a $25 template for my website and can pay $5 an article but I’m going to charge $197 because I’m big, I’m bold and that’s what the universe is calling me to do”

    4. @Barbara, I cannot express in text how much pleasure I get from reading your intelligent, and often hilarious, commentary.

      Spot on Barbara!

      1. @BananaTaco,

        Thanks, I appreciate the kind words. The PG Myers crew think I’m the biggest “kook” on the internet. They would like to pray for something bad to happen to me…but they’re not allowed.

        HA-Haw! (as Nelson Muntz would say.)

  14. I think from ms. Dumbford’s advice I found out to be successful in businesses I need to use plenty of swear-words, make some maniacal laughter and then maybe also smoke 8-10 packs a day to make the good and gravelly voice.

  15. Alexis Neely wrote:

    “Married at Burning Man, Divorced at Eden- A New Understanding of Marriage”

    “When I wrote that Russell and I decided to transition our relationship, many people asked what marriage means to me. Beneath that question, I heard a belief that marriage means a commitment to work through everything and stay together no matter what.”

    “That’s not what marriage means to me.”

    Of course not! Don’t be absurd, when our husbands or wives or those damn manipulative babies are holding us back from our bliss it’s time to “transition” them. It’s a beautiful thing to jettison those family members who no longer meet your needs. Someday they’ll thank you!

    More dreck from Alexis:

    “The Burning Man community Russell and I stood before during our marriage was not our core community……And then, as we moved outside to take our Eden family photo, Russell stood before our community, the community that was born as a result of our marriage and he set us all free…Russell and I got married at Burning Man, divorced at Eden and in the process gave birth to a community that will support us individually, in relationship as we move forward, and in all of our future relationships.”

    Now see how lovely that is? Russell set them all free! And it wasn’t painful at all! Well, not for Alexis and she’s the one who matters.

    Alexis: “I wish I could describe to you in detail how that resolution came about, but of course it was one of those “you had to be there” kind of things. Suffice it to say, things were heated.”

    Poor Russell didn’t have such a great time…sucks to be Russell…or anyone Alexis has decided to “transition” out of her life.

    1. @Barbara, Oh, there’s another New-Wage euphemism: “transition.” It’s exactly the same term that Steve Pervlina used to describe the breakup of his marriage following his polyamory experiment. Wrote Stevie, back in October of 2009:

      “…Eventually we realized we’d both be happier if we ended our marriage, not by going our own separate ways per se, but by transitioning our relationship into something other than a marriage. We love each other enough to see that we must allow each other the freedom to pursue our own individual dreams…”

      I don’t know which is more annoying: the loathsome behavior, based on the guiding principle that relationships are disposable, or the euphemistic language used to rationalize the behavior.

      People make mistakes in relationships, and ordinarily I’d say that’s their business and theirs alone. But those who choose to publicize their every thought and action regarding their most intimate relationships are, I think, fair game for criticism.

      1. @Cosmic Connie, I am far from the one man = one woman camp, but this has just gotten ridiculous. These people are taking two bits of metaphysical theory and destroying lives for it. Divorce is divorce is divorce no matter how you spin it.

        1. @LisaSimpson, Exactly. Monogamy isn’t for everyone, but in divorce, someone almost always gets hurt, despite the New-Wage gurus’ insistence that their separation or divorce was a mutual decision and a win-win for everyone. And yet the euphemisms continue. I remember that Pervlina referred to his polyamory experiment as “intimacy abundance.”

          Said he: “I spent much of the past 15 years giving a lot of my power to labels, such as marriage, husband, wife, committed, monogamous, etc. Now I can see what a huge mistake that was and how it created far more scarcity than abundance.” Later in the same piece: “Conscious people don’t need boxes to define themselves and their relationships. Instead they bring fresh choices to each relationship in the present moment.”

          There’s something very distasteful about the idea that anyone would look to these folks for real relationship advice.

            1. @LisaSimpson, Yeah, I kind of had that in the back of my mind as I was writing the comment. Joe shared his happy split-up tale in the Foreword to “Spiritual Marketing” and “The Attractor Factor.” And then hinted at the not-so-happy parts in his “Jonathan” story in “The Attractor Factor.”

            2. @LisaSimpson ::

              Yet another Fun with the Law of Attraction story that ends with a dead body.

              You fat disgusting bastard Joe Vitale … maybe NBC and ABC can do a special about that.

          1. @Cosmic Connie,


            When I was reading this part:

            Steve Pavlina
            “I spent much of the past 15 years giving a lot of my power to labels, such as marriage, husband, wife, committed, monogamous, etc.

            I imagined inserting words like “integrity”, “honesty”, “fairness”, “decency” MST3K style.

            Oh, and btw, I agree with your sentiment: “monogamy” is not for everyone.

            But it’s the flippant manner in which the guy speaks about it. I mean if you have placed a lot of “power” in the “labels” marriage, husband, wife, committed, and monogamous, you cannot then, or at least you should not lightly toss it aside after fifteen years. There are words that spring to mind to describe that, but “transition” ain’t one of them. I think “betrayal” would be closer to the mark.

            If your beliefs about those Really Big Important Concepts that those words (marriage, commitment, etc) embody starts to change, that’s a Major Life Changing deal, that’s not just some trivial thing.

            That would be like: “oh yeah I know I’ve been a dedicated humanitarian for 20 years now, but ya know, recently I’ve been realizing I’ve been giving too much of my power to labels like `humanity’ and `the sanctity of all human life’. So I’ve decided to start eating babies and using their skulls to play bowling with. *shrug* I think this’ll be a good move for me.

            People that are capable of saying things like what Pavlina said… I mean how can they not be sociopaths?

            I mean I’m a geek. I’m not always very good at saying the right thing at the right time. Often, I seem to be pretty good at saying the exact worst thing at a highly inconvenient time. But even so, I would never say or mean something as blindly stupid as what that Pavlina guy said.

            It boggles my mind. It’s like a train wreck but made out of words.

            Furry cows moo and decompress.

      2. @Cosmic Connie, Steve says, “the freedom to pursue our own individual dreams…”

        Really, he means, “the freedom to pursue my own individual sexual fantasies with whomever I want, whenever I want…”

  16. I think dumbford is confusing “manipulation” with “persuasion.” Of course, I’m not a “persuasion expert” or anything like that. Dave Lakhani is a persuasion expert, maybe we should ask him what he thinks.

    Better yet, anyone have an iPhone 4S? If so, could you ask Siri and see what she says? Thanks pimp!

  17. Questions on the pictures:
    Picture #1
    So who are the people besides Naomi and ghosty SD in the first picture?
    Is that Dave Navarro on the right?

    Who’s on the left? Just some guy?

    Was this taken at some conference?

    Picture #2
    Does anyone have evidence/know the current relationship status of Naomi and the guy in the picture that she claims to be her hubby? What about the child?

    Audio clips:
    Who is the person Naomi is speaking to in the audio clips?

    Furry cows moo and decompress.

    1. @Wyrd,

      1. This pic is one of @JadeCraven’s that she took at BlogWorld 2010. Naomi, Dave Navarro (right) and Jonathan Fields (left).

      2. Naomi left her husband Jamie and son Jack around a year ago.

    2. @Wyrd,

      Yeah – that’s my pic. I took it at Blogworld, and Anon is right that the other guy is Fields.

      At that time, they were outside for a chat. Dave hung out for a short while – like 5 minutes – before going back to the hotel room to do customer service emails.

      Also, I believe those audio clips are from the mastermind as I referenced the manipulation phrase in a blog post that has now been deleted.

      Can clarify any other q’s about the pic, the story behind it is rather tedious

    3. @Wyrd ::

      She’s talking to Dave in the clips.

      @Jade ::

      Do you remember seeing Apparitional Droid standing over there? I think I had just been kicked out of BlogWorld for saying “you can’t make money online.” I smelled sulfer and bile and stupid so I went outside to investigate. I think maybe I waved at you :: but you just rolled your eyes … and then I was like fuck this I’m going to Comic-Con.

      1. @SD,

        I didn’t see that, actually. I was panicking about the pic being used as I took a couple of pics of the D-team while there and don’t want people to hate me.

        The geek part of me reckons it’s awesome and that I’d rather go to Comic Con over blogworld again any day.

      2. @SD,

        I wish Dave had known not to listen to her.

        I really wish that.

        Dave: the clue is all the re-defining. (I mean, I’m sure there’s a zillion, but for me, the Ultimate Red Flag, is always the thing where someone tries to take something that we commonly consider to be “bad” and then, in a matter of moments of their speaking, it is suddenly supposed to be not bad.

        It’s like sleight of hand, but inside your head.

        If you are having a conversation with someone and if, after the conversation is over, it feels a bit like you are waking up from a dream–that’s another Big Red Flag. It means they just mind-fucked you. And they probably didn’t have your permission to do that to you, so now you should feel pissed off. Intentionally don’t do whatever the fuck it was they MANIPULATED you into agreeing to do, and don’t ever talk to them again.

        One last analogy: if, after talking to someone, you sort of feel like Clarice Starling did when she tried to talk to Lecter, then that’s a fucking clue! That person is bad mojo.

        Naomi should be branded with a BIOHAZARD label or something.

        Manipulators piss me off. I feel about manipulators the way Cartman feels about hippies. (I’m ok with hippies.)

        Furry cows moo and decompress.

  18. @SD Just wondering something … what’s the end game here?

    You’ve been building a case. A curse-word-ridden, funny, sad, brick-and-mortar case. Against the Spider. Against Dave (when he switched from being just a victim to victimizer).

    Now what?

    Shining a light, and the concomitant heat, on mold kills it. Or at least beats it back to a state of relative invisibility/harmlessness.

    What is this light doing?

    Perhaps you’re working with Alison and/or Anthony on something you can’t tell us about. I get that.

    I just hope there’s an end game in here somewhere, because just being pissed all the time seems a terrible waste of ire.

    Also, I’m noticing (a la her blog and shiny new newsletter) that Naomi and/or Dave are ramping up for a new cycle of “business”. I know the bad guys sometimes win, but just this one time I’d like to see that not be the case.

    1. @curious…, The light is exposing the underbelly of the B team. Showing that the magenta, black and white world of “business is different over here” doesn’t actually exist.

      1. @SD,

        People always say that, but it never works out.

        “All power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.”

        Now, OTOH, if you’ll just hand me the crown, then I’ll have this all sorted out in just a few minutes. I’ll just change the quote to the cool kid version:
        “All power corrupts. Absolute power is fun.” [for me]

        But the real problem with giving all the power to just one person is: suppose that, that sole leader-dictator person actually isn’t so bad after all. It might be possible to imagine one all-powerful dictator who is, on balance, not very evil (you know–doesn’t do away with due process or apply a 99% tax on breathing and the leader’s idea of being corrupt is just asking someone to peel their grapes first.)

        Even in that unlikely case, long term, everybody’s still screwed. Because inevitably there’ll come the time for the passing of the crown to the successor. it might be possible to have one all-powerful leader that isn’t very evil, but long term, you’re gonna have a bad one. And then you’re gonna have a worse one that promises he only wants to get rid of the bad one right up until he gets crowned. And so on.

        “Democracy is the worst form of government. Except for all the other ones.”

        Furry cows moo and decompress.

        1. @Wyrd ::

          I didn’t say it’d be good for humanity Churchill :: just that I could end this … in minutes.

          Federal :: State :: and local authorities have it within their means {and are under the obligation} to end all of this oh so quickly … but don’t and won’t.

          That’s just one of the hundreds of ways I’ve answered the stupid question :: “when are you going to do everything?”

          1. @SD,

            Oh, ok. That’s cool.

            Yeah. Well, I mean no offense to @curious but the “what’s your end game” question seemed so overly direct (and a bit non sequitur) that it didn’t really stick after I read it.

            I haven’t been reading here at the site for very long. So I’m not familiar with all the vile characters. But I have dipped into the archives a bit. I heard your interview with the non-evil SEO guy, and I saw the blog posts in which you revealed your identity so as to remove any leverage that Random-Evil-IM-Guy might try to put on you once one of his PI’s finally managed to adequately perform their job.

            So. What that means is that I understand that behind the droid you’re a dude somewhere out therez. And you have a life and all its complexities.

            The mission is the maintenance of the blog and the rules for how/what constitutes a valid article posting.

            The end game is the mission. Except of course for when things get messy and too real and horrible. In those cases, the end game is just trying to help people that desperately need it.

            Please correct me if I have mischaracterized or made any other errors.

            Furry cows moo and decompress.

  19. A new newsletter for everyone! She’s excited to share (oh wait, no she’s not… but, oh wait, yes she is)!

    Reading her newsletter is nauseating. Apparently she is finally ready to fix the site after the horrible ‘hack’ that occurred. She is going to be ‘going through the rubble’ to bring back old articles. The first gems she is pulling out:

    The Golden Minute – What to do when a brand new fan arrives. (Hint: It’s not hard. I promise.)

    Don’t Listen To Stupid People – What to do when your mother/sister/spouse tells you not to do that thing you really think you should do.

    Wow, just wow. She is telling me that my family and spouse are stupid people. This is manipulation at its core, because if your spouse is smart they will question this line of work. If you think your spouse is stupid, then there are other issues in your life and you may just be in a place to believe this crap.

    Also coming up on in the itty biz world:

    Thursday, we’re going to talk about The Confessional. I can’t tell you anything more than that, except that there are confessions involved.

    Think she will:

    – Confess to the affair
    – Confess to ripping a family apart
    – Confess to lying to her followers about her level of success
    – Confess to trying to evade taxes
    – Confess to being an unethical business person who lies and manipulates
    – Confess to never paying her affiliate fees
    – Confess to sending a minor an e-mail that is entirely inappropriate
    – Confess to making up that whole ‘Death Threat’ nonsense
    – Confess to hacking her own site so she could take everything down and then come back ‘all clean’

    I’m not holding my breath. Whatever she confesses will be done to manipulate the masses and make them see that she admits to making some mistakes and that she is ready to move forward.

    SD, I’m so curious who you consider to be the A-team players in this IM/3T craziness. I’m pretty sure it isn’t isolated to the list on this post. Hoping that a full expose is coming around this ‘syndicate’.

    1. @susie, I’m pretty sure that Brian Clark is towards the top of the 3T ladder but he’s not at the same level as the syndicate people (Frank Kern, Ed Dale etc.)

      Naomi won’t change. She’s put herself in a mindset which says that anyone who calls her out is an idiot, simply for not agreeing with her. Any crimes that get outdid that she has committed she can easily just swot them with her “I don’t care about haters who hold me back” line.

      That’s the scary part – it really does seem like she’s got nothing to lose. SD has accused her (successfully) of doing some pretty terrible things but she just doesn’t give a damn and will almost certainly keep her scam train running. In fact, I’m willing to bet that she will try to turn it around into a “only the most successful people get haters” type of thing when her blog starts to come back to life again.

      She is a truly disgusting human being who really doesn’t (or doesn’t seem to in any case) care about anything or anyone.

      1. @Brian Clark is a big fat phoney, Sadly, you’re probably right. I keep thinking there has to be something wrong here. Something we’ve all missed. But, try as I might to give her the benefit of the doubt all I can come up with is every kind of indication there is no doubt for her to benefit from.

    2. @susie ::

      Well :: if you look back over The Syndicate story … you’ll see that I never made a list. Irwin made a list … and Andy made a list … so I talked about those lists {which were not complete}.

      IMO :: such cartels are major federal felonies :: a very strong accusation :: so making a list is a bad idea without 100% certainty about its accuracy.

      1. @SD,

        Watch out! Your lawyer-ness is coming out again. You are accidentally revealing the fact that you’re actually smart, have a real law education, and that you Know Real Things That Matter instead of just BS things like “how to grow your income to 6 figures in 12 easy steps”.

        If you keep that up, the big french-for-trade-union kids might get scared and stop playing.

        Nah, but of course they won’t. They can’t stop because they all killed their consciousnesses a long time ago, and their egos are far too big to let truth seep in.

        The relentless pursuit of money at all “costs” will do that to a person.

        Furry cows moo and decompress.

      2. @SD,

        Didn’t some poor idiot butcher just make the news for keeping a rolodex in his shop of all his Mafia contacts, complete with every person’s rank in the hierarchy? I think the FBI called it a “gold mine”.

        Yeah, he’s sleeping soundly o’ nights.

        Introducing Mojo’s exciting new Coaching for Criminals Course! Sure, I might not be a criminal and hence have no real qualifications, but so long as I keep talking real fast YOU’ll never find out! Besides, your first lesson is FREE! That’s right, FREE! How could you go wrong with an offer like that? And here it is:

        Lesson Number One–Don’t Keep Lists!

        Lesson Number Two–If You *DO* Keep Lists, Why the “Delete” Key On Your Computer Doesn’t Work on the Whole Entire Internet. (But THAT one’s gonna cost ya! Big time! Sign up today!)

    3. @susie,

      I found your list of the things Naomi ought to confess to very amusing. I mean: I know it’s not a joke–she did all those things and it’s all very bad. It’s just the list is so long seeing it all in one place is actually funny to me in a sardonic sort of way.

      The actual acts themselves are definitely not funny. In particular, being complicit in ripping a family apart, then lying about it and all the other crap she did is definitely in the evil category not the funny category.

      But on the hacking thing: I’m not sure if she did hack her own site. I mean, I wasn’t reading Salty’s blog at the time. I understand that he had nothing to do with it. But even if none of the commenters here had nothing to do with it, that doesn’t necessarily mean she rigged it.

      In her chat log to David way back when, she mentioned that the site lost a lot of traffic after the hack (and I’m thinking “duh!”). That seems like the sort of shoot-yourself-in-the-foot that narcissist Naomi wouldn’t consider.

      But of course I could be wrong. :-)

      Furry cows moo and decompress.

      1. @Wyrd,

        Yeah, it is quite a list (and that isn’t even everything that has been brought to light!). She is definitely a piece of work. You’re probably right on the hacking thing.

      2. @Wyrd,

        I’m fairly sure she didn’t hack her own site. Most of the “coaching” I’ve seen instructs people to jump onto all the user-cuddly apps–Facebook, Twitter, WordPress–so they don’t have to deal with all that icky techie stuff.

        I’m sure if 99% of them were faced with an actual UNIX prompt they’d freak.

          1. @MKR,

            “But … but … I thought an ‘alias’ was something I use when trolling the Droid’s site so nobody will know it was me!”

            1. @mojo, And a kernel panic is when you bump the microwave panel and add 10 minutes to a bag of popcorn.

            2. @mojo,

              I know some Linux.

              And I can rm -vrf /* as root and watch it all burn (bye, bye OS!) but don’t ever ask me to configure sendmail. IMHO that thing’s a nightmare. I always tell myself I should switch to Ububuntu, but here I am still on Windows. It’s the Evil Empire. But it’s easy. It would be nice if they didn’t put everything in binary so much though. Source is better.

              Furry cows moo and decompress.

    4. @susie,

      You said:

      “Wow, just wow. She is telling me that my family and spouse are stupid people. This is manipulation at its core, because if your spouse is smart they will question this line of work. If you think your spouse is stupid, then there are other issues in your life and you may just be in a place to believe this crap.”

      Ding!! Ding!! Ding!! We have a winner.

      That’s what spouses do, they discuss. Sometimes certain expenditures don’t fit in the family budget and it’s not being unsupporitive to point that out. It’s also not being unsuppportive to disagree on whether or not something is a scam.

      See, this is what gets me about all the IM people who are selling a dream. To them a perfect life is lying beach side, sipping a mai tai, never working again and loved ones be damned if they don’t buy into it. But that’s not reality.

      Reality is the family, an equal partnership. Families aren’t disposable and the IMs need to stop selling a my way or the highway lifestyle.

      1. @SpideySenses, Like…as in…people who CARE about you and might be concerned about your welfare. People who, not basking in the warm glow of all the manipulation, might dare to voice objections to the idea because — God forbid — it just doesn’t add up.

      2. @SpideySenses, exactly – when you get married you agree to share a life. not lay down while the other one drives your family finances into the ground.

      3. @SpideySenses ::

        To them a perfect life is lying beach side, sipping a mai tai, never working again and loved ones be damned if they don’t buy into it.

        I’d just make this one small change …

        To them a perfect life is sitting around drunk snorting a beach, never working again and loved ones be damned if they don’t buy into it.

  20. Marie Forleo’s book review on Amazon:

    “Sadly, this was indeed a case of GREAT marketing… way too great. The title completely oversold the book. What I expected to read was a helpful guide overviewing some of the pitfalls that trip up women and make them self-sabotage on dates. What I found instead was a useless pep talk written by someone who honestly comes across as a 20-year-old college cheerleader. “You’re so fabulous!!” and “You are an amazing, irresistable woman!” scream up at you from every page until you want to shake the book and throw it against the wall. Tell me something useful.” I completely agree with the reviewer who said that Forleo doesn’t present a single original idea in this entire book. It’s basically a book of other people’s thoughts cobbled together in the peppy cheerleader voice.” written by Elisa R. Tomlinson

    This was from a review of Forleo’s book “Make Every Man Want You: How to Be So Irresistible You’ll Barely Keep from Dating Yourself!” 243 people found that review to be helpful. On her Amazon page Forleo says she has two careers, life coaching and dance fitness.

    She talks about her book in an interview with Mike Michalowicz “Self-published, baby! No patience for traditional publishers. Too many compromises. Figured I could do it better myself. Went on to sell 8,000 copies, because I used smart direct marketing jedi tricks!” And speaks about her dance career “Zero professional training; All passion and lot’s and lot’s of balls. Traditional wisdom says to start dancing at 26 is crazy – way too old. I say screw traditional wisdom!”

    There you have it in a nutshell. Jedi “tricks”, “lot’s and lot’s of balls” (does anyone understand why she put the apostrophe in lot’s? Does she think it’s “lot is” or does she think it’s possessive?), zero professional training (naturally, education and training are for losers), and screwing wisdom. I wonder if she’s got a hot date with herself tonight…

    1. @Barbara, Her videos on her site certainly look like she’s gearing up for a hot date. Apparently bedroom eyes can get you anywhere online.

    2. @Barbara,

      does anyone understand why she put the apostrophe in lot’s? Does she think it’s “lot is” or does she think it’s possessive?

      I don’t know why she does that. But I’ve seen Salty make the same mistake on several different occasions. And if he over-apostrophizes, it can’t be that bad.

  21. When I see these two trailer-ites in the photo above, it deeply saddens me that they were telling people they were rich in order to get other slobs and claudes to pay the septic tank cleaning and satellite bills.

    Wow, Alison. Really, I know this is hard but you and the kids are going to be better off for it. Seeing that photo and reading everything else, I can see Dave’s future written on the wall and you DO NOT want any part of it.

    God bless you and your brother in law for fighting the good fight and having the courage to tell your story.

    Oh yes, anyone who wants to know about some of the other company Rock Your Dave keeps, click here and look to the very bottom left of the soundboard. There wasn’t a youtube clip of this but I hope even a droid will get a laugh out of this.

    The General

  22. Dave Navarro gets a shout out on Family Guy. Apparently, Herbert the Pervert is a Launch Coach reader. Check the video out about about :45

      1. @SD,

        Good stuff, Droid.

        I wonder if they were dropping Dave Navarro’s name to get into that now-infamous SXSW event. I used to go SXSW when I lived in Austin and it felt like it was where all the nobodys went to pretend to be somebodys. FWIW.

  23. The IttyBiz Confessional, now featuring Naomi on quitting Twitter:

    “Standard capitalist theory suggests that in business, the people you are supposed to focus on are your customers and clients.”

    Please, Professor Dunford, tell us more about capitalist theory. I hope you address Trotsky’s theory of “uneven and combined development”. Compare and contrast the theories of Lenin and Bukharin particularly as related to economic competition between monopoly producers and would you please give us a brief overview of Adam Smith’s idea of “the invisible hand of the marketplace”?

    Then you can return to talking about squatting under your kitchen table and emptying your bladder into a juice pitcher.

  24. I’m just curious about what other kind of capitalism there might be besides standard. Don’t seem to recall being taught that at the high falutin’ university I attended. Leave it to Neigh Owe Me to school me proper.

    1. @General Unicorn aka Rock Your Dave!,

      If you act now and send Naomi $497 she’ll tell you all about those other kinds of capitalism. Don’t wait! Supplies are limited.

    2. “An Inquiry into the Nature and Causes of the Wealth of Nations”

      Updated for the TwitterGeneration by drop-out cow mouth Naomi Dumbford. Now featuring pictures of fat girls in stupid outfits … and approximately 100% less text.

      Get your crap copy today before the Invisible Hand bitch slaps your Equilibrium!

      1. @SD,

        If my Twitter stream is any indication, us fat girls have re-appropriated the term fat girls (and we thrifted those stupid outfits for a themed bicycle ride, thankyouverymuch), so you’ll have to be more specific in your insults to drop-out cow mouth. I like to think of her as 161.5 pounds of rancid cottage cheese stuffed into a 95-pound-rated sweaty leotard.

  25. More from Naomi’s latest:

    “Your peers were your support network getting to this point. They helped you through some tough times. They gave you someone to talk to on those nights when you’re so excited about business that you’re bursting, but your spouse gives you blank (or disgusted) looks whenever you bring it up.”

    That’s it, Naomi, get in another hit at those worthless spouses, the ones daring to give you and Dave those disgusted looks as you schemed together to leave all of your obligations behind. You just can’t resist the temptation to vent your spleen, can you Naomi?

    The sad thing for Dave that he hasn’t realized yet is that Naomi only wanted him because he was unavailable. Now that she has him his value has dropped. Remember all of the rotten things Naomi said about her other husband(s)? She’ll be saying the same things about you Dave, when she traps her next victim in her sticky web.

    Here’s a quote from Shari Schreiber on this topic:

    “No reasonably sane woman will abandon her children, or expect you to leave yours! If she’s leaving a marriage, that’s one thing–if she’s leaving her kids behind, that’s quite another. Think of it this way; if she can walk away from her own child, how secure do you think you’ll be in this relationship??”

  26. Thank you Naomi Dunford for the clearest and most succinct summing up of your profession I’ve ever heard. Such a powerful vision of the marketeer as shameless infantile parasite. It perfectly illustrates the role you see your customers playing in your life: pouring their hard earned cash (or not-yet-earned credit) into the large end of an umbilicus leading to your bank account.

    I dunno, maybe anyone who can talk like that without feeling mortified with embarrassment really does deserve to be “loved” (i.e. given money).

    1. @Yakaru ::

      Actually :: umbilicus to the bank account of one James Dunford. You’ll recall from the chat that Neigh-Neigh has had a few problems in the maintaining clean accounts department.

      1. @SD,

        Yes, I remembered there was some tricky stuff about bank accounts, but I didn’t know how to work it in without making the sentence extend around the corner.

        1. Well … if anybody out there has made a regrettable IttyBiz purchase in the last month or six … I’d be curious to find out how it was billed.

          And if anyone wants to look at their past IttyBiz continuity billings :: I’m sure we’d all be quite curious to hear about any changes in the billing patterns over time.

          1. @SD, payment went to James Dunford in August. Found this site shortly after. Wish I had found it before!

            1. @Feeling Foolish, yup, same here – payment to James Dunford in August.

              I’m betting you and I bought the same damn thing :)

          2. @SD,

            Ok, I’m confused. Did Naomi leave her hubbie James/Jamie last year or not? I’m guessing the answer is: “we don’t know”. ?

            Furry cows moo and decompress.

            1. @Wyrd,

              They have probably done the new-fangled ‘transition’ thing which seems to mean separation in everything to do with partnership—- except future marketing opportunities.
              Which tells what the real, concrete and lasting basis of the relationship really was, because that is what has endured when all else is gone.

            2. @Wyrd, ok. I know it’s way off topic but it’s been driving me nuts & I finally just have to ask. What does “furry cows moo & decompress” mean?

            3. @Anonymous,

              It’s my signature. Look me up!”furry+cows+moo+and+decompress” []

              Instead of explaining its first origin, it’s easier to explain it this way: My patronus is a big furry cow. When the dementor approaches, the cow explodes for no apparent reason.

              Sometimes–just before overwhelming depression has you in its cold embrace, there’s still a chance to dispel it with a well timed blast of crazy absurdity.


              Furry cows moo and decompress.

  27. From Naomi Dunfords latest newsletter:

    (Its towards the end. I gallantly made a great effort on behalf of those Droid readers who may not have been able to read all of it.)

    “Next week (when we’re doing “I’m scared I’ll never be awesome”) we’ll have a Confession Box up where you can submit your own questions and concerns. (OK, what I really mean by that is, “you can come and tell me all the things that make you terrified and then I’ll hold your hair back while you puke.” Fun, yes?) ”

    She’ll hold your hair back while you puke!

    What a gal!!
    Wonder if she lets you use the juice container into which she pisses?

    Ah and by the way: I think there’s still a few tickets available for Mile Filsaimes marketers cruise. Hurry and book before they’re all gone! And bring your family.

    But I think I’d rather spew into Naomi’s juice container than have my wife and kids exposed to that lot for a week!

    1. @EricG, Isn’t that some kind of psychological game. “Come tell me your deepest darkest fears so I know exactly how to manipulate you in the future.”

      1. @LisaSimpson,

        Yes, undoubtedly these revelations would be used in future. (and probably published as a WSO as well)

        The first priority of all of these guruwankers is to get people to trust them.
        Their guiding mantra is
        “Sincerity is everything. If you can fake that, you’ve got it made”.
        Once trust exists, people will share all kinds of stuff that they would not normally disclose.
        For example, Alison trusted SD and told her story.
        I can’t see her doing that with just anyone.

        You have to be very selective about who you trust.
        Robert Cialdini’s “Influence – The Psychology of Persuasion” will help you do this, and identify the practices used by just about all the A,B,C and D list if internet marketers.

        And once you get people to trust you for the right reasons, you have to be extra careful not to do things that will damage that trust.
        Like promoting stuff put out by the guruwankers.

        I spend a far bit of time talking people out of making bad purchases.
        And thanks to Salty, have a lot more reasons than I could have ever researched by myself.

  28. Anyone else notice DN has a ring on his finger in that stupid picture of him acting like some tough guy on his sales page? I can haz NLP?

  29. Manipulation, in a bad sense, has one or more of the following elements:

    1. Deliberate concealment or mis-statement of facts. You hide the fact that you are bankrupt when you encourage someone to invest in your business. Or you actively lie and state you are making money hand over fist.

    2. Deliberately concealing agenda. Pretending you are there to help when, in reality, you are out to suck people dry.

    3. Pressing down on pain buttons: difficult emotions like fear, self-doubt, shame, guilt.

    If it doesn’t contain at least one of these, it’s more likely “persuasion”.


  30. The Havi Brooks & Naomi Dunford Mutual Appreciation Society:

    Havi: ” Naomi is a potty mouth. She once wrote a blog post that included a paragraph that was composed almost entirely of the word “slut”. Thirteen times in one post. And she called my duck a whore!”

    Havi: “She’s good at:
    •Explaining stuff you don’t actually want to go out and learn yourself.
    •Helping you feel better about absolutely everything and getting charged up with how cool it is.
    •Making money (I assume you already read her “$12,246 in an afternoon” post).
    •Strategy. God, she does strategy like nobody’s business.”

    Havi: “She’s like a fun, drunk Canadian version of me. But curse-ier.
    How is she like me? Let me count the creepy ways. Like me, she’s a Pisces! Actually her birthday is one day after mine. And she has my old haircut.
    Weird, huh? Also, did I mention that my middle name is Naomi? It is. Weird, huh? I’ve got to stop saying that.”

    Let’s review, shall we?

    Naomi Dunford’s idea of a business blog post is saying slut thirtenn times.
    Naomi’s idea of humor is referring to a child’s rubber duck bath toy as a whore.
    Naomi can explain “stuff” you don’t want to learn for yourself.
    ( note to Havi: If I don’t want to learn it why should I care that she can explain it? Next time try to be more specific, the word “stuff” is too vague )
    Naomi can make you feel better about absolutely everything. ( Havi, does this “everything” include abandoning your children? How about not paying your affiliates? Does it include not paying taxes to federal and state governments?)
    Naomi explains how to make $12,000 in a single afternoon on the internet. ( Havi, has Naomi had her colors done? I’m afraid her orange jumpsuit is going to clash with her complexion.)
    Naomi is a Canadian who swears a lot, drinks too much, cuts her hair with dog shears, and was born between Frbruary 20th and March 20th. (yawn)


    1. @Barbara,

      Havi is an interesting character in this group. She comes across as less scammy, IMO, because she is actually providing a service that is considered legitimate by the masses (i.e. Yoga/shivanata). But, once you peel back the layers just a little bit, the scam is clear and the affiliate/JV pieces are able to be seen.

      The pieces that really stand out:

      – Kitchen Table Program (straight out of third tribe vanacular)
      – eBooks for learning how to overcome anxiety and fear (this seems to be a general theme in the IM world)
      – Help for highly sensitive people (I didn’t even know this term until I started reading blogs by the IM people)
      – ‘Launches’ that are clearly driven by emotion (and the fear that you won’t get in if you don’t act now because her ‘stuff’ fills up quickly).

      There is more, but this is the top of mind stuff.

      Most importantly, she still links to Naomi from her blog. This is enough to put her squarly in the scammy group, IMO. Many have removed Naomi, quietly. She hasn’t even done that. Either she is clueless, or she supports her. Either way, it makes her someone who is not to be trusted for so-called advice.

      1. @susie, highly sensitive people is an actual term in the real world too. But you can learn all about it and get all the help you need with about $30 from Amazon. No need to pay a guru to help you through that.

        1. @LisaSimpson,

          Thanks for the reply. I really hadn’t heard of it until I started reading the IM/3T blogs. So many people in this community talk about it, that it appears as something that is used for manipulating people emotionally (and, IMO, it is used for that).

        2. @LisaSimpson, There’s also a site by Elaine Aron, one of the main researchers into Sensory-Processing Sensitivity aka High Sensitivity.

          Aron lists actual peer-reviewed papers instead of “here’s some ideas I just pulled out of my ass” unlike the IM/3T circles.

          1. @Sheila,

            Great to know! I know there had been some research but I’d only read a book or two. I think that highly sensitive people may be drawn to 3T work because of the whole “you’re doing good and not having to get out into real society” thing. Which can be enticing if you’re highly sensitive.

      2. @susie,

        I’d be curious to know who all has removed Naomi and/or DN from their testimonials and affiliates. That might be an interesting list.

    2. @Barbara

      …and further to that (nice recap : ) Havi’s only legitimate product is a shivanata video that is actually – holding breaths? – *not* her…It’s the original Russian dude who invented it. And for only $75 you get a thick booklet of extra bullshit with that whereupon you are inundated with her ‘Havispeak’ (see her ‘glossary’ for that yuckfest lexicon).

      Basically, she has repackaged someone else’s product and she uses other’s sensitivity or anxiety proneness to make money.

      Yeah. Classy.

  31. I had given the Neely marriage 6 months!! (LOL)

    The next coach scam theme of the month is:

    “truth telling:))))”


    “don’t need as much now” Cause the Family Wealth Planning Institute didn’t really make millions, it actually made $300k!

    Getting real near bankruptcy, so do what I do to sell asset protection!

    The lawsuit filed against her tells a thousand stories.

    “own a farm and live off the land, and scam more people w/ hard sales.”

    Seriously no one buys into this stuff, unless they are reeeeeallly young and naive!

  32. Strange. I am still on Ms Dunford’s mailing list (as I am on Dave Navarro’s, because I used to enjoy Dave’s Monday emails).

    Now, having not heard much for a while & not giving it much thought, all of a sudden I’ve been getting a few emails from Ms Dunford. 4, in fact, since 27th October. That’s what, a couple of times a week?

    Anyway. I thought I’d share this one with you.

    Today’s lesson:

    “(Title) Is “submit” good enough? A lesson on branding‏.

    (email text)I was on a website the other day that had one of those pop up “sign up for my newsletter” boxes and I actually didn’t hate it. (Despite what your social media consultant tells you, those boxes aren’t all bad. They’re just bad when they’re done badly, which is, admittedly, pretty much always.)

    You know when you sign up for the newsletter, the button that you click normally says “submit”?

    This one said “gimme!”


    What an interesting word choice.

    It conjured up so much. It conjured up that part of the self that wants to take and not give, the part that wants the cake to always be free, the part that wants to stay three years old forever.

    And on this particular website, that was completely perfect. (I wouldn’t necessarily recommend this button text for you if you’re not in the business of selling to the greedy. It’s a little… greedy.)

    I got to thinking, what else would work? “Yes, please!” would be a nice touch. Kind of sweet. Like getting in touch with your inner nine-year-old instead of your inner three-year-old. “Okay!” could work. “I’m in!” “Woohoo!”

    Lots of possibilities, all with their own unique micro-branding opportunities. The feeling you get when you click “Woohoo!” is a little bit different than the feeling you get when you click “Gimme!”, and that feeling can reinforce so much.

    I co-taught a class once where the buy button said “Hell, yeah!” When Dave set up my Advance Discount List (oh my God, that was in 2008! I feel about a hundred years old!) he used “Screw paying retail. Sign me up!” and we liked it so much, we kept it.

    (Again, you probably wouldn’t want to use that kind of tone all by itself. The header for the page reads, “You want to save money? Fine, let Jack starve.” So it’s not like “screw paying retail” is going to catch them unawares.)

    The real opportunities for branding come in the tiniest places, the places that don’t seem to matter much at all. The real opportunities for branding are ones you can take in a matter of moments. The real opportunities for branding are almost always free.

    Where are your opportunities?

    (Caveat: DO NOT THINK ABOUT THIS TODAY if you’re currently enrolled in the Emergency Turnaround Clinic. You’re in turnaround! You don’t have time for this! Go find something and sell it.)

    We think that branding for small business is about logos and typefaces and huge social media initiatives.

    Logos help, yes.

    Typefaces help.

    Huge social media campaigns have been known to help, sometimes.

    But when someone clicks the button to say they want to receive your newsletter, what does the button say? If it says “submit”, you’re probably wasting an opportunity.

    And when someone clicks the confirmation link that comes after they sign up, what does your thank you page say? If it’s the one that came with your newsletter software, you’re definitely wasting an opportunity. (Hint: Link to your store.)

    What does the footer of your website say? What does the envelope look like? What’s in your email signature line?

    You don’t need to wait until you can hire a logo designer to start working on your branding.

    What could you be working on today?


    Basically, I think what she means to say is – don’t forget you can customise your stuff. But what a strange rambling way of saying it (and this coming from me, who tends to ramble more than most!).


    1. @Nikki,

      While you got the email from Dunford’s email list, that’s 100% Dave Navarro writing there. So much for both of their “branding” – he’s now a part of Ittybiz “brand” and where is she?

  33. anyone have any opinions on Danielle LaPorte? She had a pay-what-you-can day for her fire starter workbook. So I paid $20, but was shocked that the original price is $150! What you get is PDF of like 200 pages that you have to print out on your own. Now I only did the very first section, and grew tired of it as it’s just like all the other self-help stuff out there. I’m going to try to complete it over winter break and see if I can understand why people are buying into this stuff…

    I won’t lie…I was gullible. But then I realized that there isn’t really much “kick ass” about it. Glad that I don’t recognize any of the names listed above. I’m done drinking the kool-aid. But its mindboggling that I can’t find any critical or skeptical review of her work…

    1. @Annala,

      It’s designed so you can’t find any critical reviews, if there are any out there. Danielle recommends the other people in the group, and they recommend her back. Maybe when her Random House book comes out in April we’ll see an honest review from an actual critic.

      In the meantime, we have opinions about “Sell Your Soul” and other LaPorte ventures:

  34. @Annala, I noticed the same thing with a lot of internet marketers. For instance, whenever I’ve been tempted to pay for some business programme, I do several google searches and find that there are little to no genuine reviews. For instance, a few weeks back I tempted to join Laura Roeder’s Creating Fame and then googled for reviews but the only things that came up were either from her own site or from blogs that were clearly affiliates. Thank God I came across Droid, otherwise I would have spend a heap paying for various ebooks and programmes like LaPorte’s and Roeder’s.

    This blog has reinforced what my instincts have been telling me recently: the only person who can guide you to business success is you (and the good man upstairs of course). No matter how many guru’s you follow, you’ll never really learn about business/blogging success until you walk the walk and take action.

    Some of the actions of these so called guru’s is appalling and beyond scamming. I definitely have lost respect for some of th

    1. @Mel, Also we have good news from Tiffany Dow about good scam-circle-reviewers in the Warrior Forum, while mr. P Brown goes about yelling to people that only “real product reviews” are allowed in WF product review section and then forgets to notice about that so many hi-5 reviews coming from the same mouth-to-forum people because no, we can’t know for sure about it (maybe T.Dow can tell them more about it then go get banned from the forum then for spewing so much bad no-proof nonsense)…

      It’s a recap here from her comment:

      “When some “mastermind” guru group invited me to be part of their group, and I accepted thinking it would be neat to brainstorm and learn more, I quit later that same afternoon when I saw what it was – nothing more than 1 person posting for another in WF about their product, followed by a series of “yeah this is great” posts from the other mastermind members, and concluding with an “aww shucks” post by the product creator.”

  35. So glad this blog exists, because I was beginning to think that something was wrong with “ME”…I’ve had it up to HERE with this self-help nonsense. I guess I was about 21 when Oprah showed “The Secret” on her show and that’s when I got hooked. That was about 4 years ago, and I have to admit that some of the stuff did encourage me to get up off my ass and get my life moving in the direction I wanted it to go in…so in some regards, it’s cool. But I have problems with shaming people who truly can’t help their conditions, and then blaming them for it. My one friend whose mother operates some new-age, pseudo-scientology center in Miami, in a deep conversation about Rwanda and its genocide, said that somewhere in some other realm, those people “attracted” their deaths. I know this is a tangent, but its all in alignment with being fed up with these frauds!

    LaPorte’s pay-what-you-can day had a little footnote that said something along the lines: if you can’t devote just $20 to making your life totally fucking awesome after you read this mindblowing workbook that such and such said is really worth thousands, then you need to do some serious soul-searching. Or some shit like that…

    So glad to have finally found a place to vent!

    Yesterday I donated 20 bucks to charity, not a whole lot but slowly and surely, I’m reframing my mind to stop spending my money on superfluous shit and putting it where it counts. Wish I could get my $20 back from Laporte, I feel totally duped.

    1. @Annala,

      Thats part of the deal, that you get to thinking something’s wrong with you.

      Hard sell goes like this:
      Rule 1: find the customer’s pain.
      Rule 2: insert knife into pain.
      Rule 3: really twist that knife.

      People pay to stop the pain. Its called emotional manipulation or the con.

      Welcome to the darkside, its a whole lot more fun than ‘saving the world, one ebook at a time.’

    2. @Annala,

      I just discovered another cool blog that maybe explains more how Danielle LaPorte and the rest operate:

      There is a great article there that I think will help you titled “Get Rich With a PDF EBook Full of Waffle and Lettuce”:

      Writing my best selling PDF EBook was the easiest thing I have ever done. I did it before breakfast while brushing my teeth and stroking the cat.

  36. Make Money Blogging About Making Money Blogging is my blog about the silliness of the “SEO affiliate marketing pro-blogger PDF Ebook gurudom” industry.

    I’m a bit upset that you have discovered it yet because I haven’t finished my PDF EBook yet.

    I didn’t know about The Salty Droid until now! There goes my only original idea!

    1. @Alex,

      I’ll buy your PDF ebook, Alex, if you ever get it finished.
      I’m a sucker for an unoriginal original idea.

    2. @Alex ::

      How dare you think you could make jokes about pyramid schemes without my express written consent … I’ll be sending some of my people out to deal with you. I’m rough like that … just ask Naomi Dunford … I killed her and all her friends just because of how much I love Jesus.

    3. @Alex,

      Sorry, you’re much too late into this profitable industry.
      This E-Book is the leader in it’s field, and tells people everything they need to know.

      But hey – most people buy everything that’s available on the topic, so you might pick up a few crumbs that have been left on that famous table upon which people are always leaving money.

      1. @EricG, This great: I will add it to a new linkbait post about the top ten PDF EBook sites on the Interweb. Maybe I can get me some backlink magic!

  37. Thank you for the link. I have approached them about an affiliate marketing deal that will make us all gazillionaires!

  38. Not sure where else to post this, so I picked here…

    It seems that as of this coming Monday, Dave Navarro is employed by Naomi Dunford.

    From a newsletter sent out by Dave today:

    “So I have a bit of funny news for you.

    “As of Monday morning, my heart and mind belong to IttyBiz.

    “Which is a bit of a laugh for me because I’d swore I’d never take a “day job” again.

    “But this is my last week as a free man.

    “Come Monday, I work for Naomi.”

    Really? I’m no longer *formerly* confused, since I thought he already either worked for or owned ittybiz.


    1. @formerly confused,

      They’ve been sharing a mailing address for months. This is news to his followers, but not to anyone who’s been following the story. Nice to see him at least acknowledging that his “heart and mind” belong to Naomi in public.

      1. @Anon ::

        I hadn’t noticed him having any heart or mind.

        I’m sure it’s going to be nothing but smooth sailing for IttyBiz :: all they have to worry about is me.

    2. @formerly confused, it’s cute how he pretends like Ittybiz is a real business that employs people…lol!

    3. @formerly confused, Besides his “heart” and his “mind,” what other part of him now “belongs” to Naomi? I would suggest he pull his head out of his ass, but I’m thinking he needs to pull it out of some other place. How revolting.

  39. So while I’m still pissy that I spent $20.00 bucks on her stupid “Fire Starter Sessions” e-book, I’m happy to find that people have been calling her out on Amazon. Not enough though…but if you look up her book, and read the 2-star reviews, you will find some spot-on reviews that call her out on the BS.

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